#indiewebcamp 2012-04-03

2012-04-03 UTC
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aaronpk
although it doesn't support facebook right now anyway since they broke their html view of public profiles
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mkowens
Ah. Gotcha. I am good at breaking things.
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aaronpk
always an important skill
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mkowens
Indeed.
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mkowens
I'm going to likely try some other stuff related to indieauth sometime, but the fact that Twitter worked flawlessly was nice.
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aaronpk
awesome
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mkowens
It looks like a much better solution than OpenID in general, but I was trying to think of a way that a user like myself who may have multiple auth options could "pre-select" which option to use.
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mkowens
Or, for example, what happens when you find multiple auth options: do you present the user with a choice or just assume they don't care which they use?
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mkowens
In general, for example, I prefer to use Facebook as my identity provider except when the content is likely to be more valuable connected with Twitter or Github or whatever.
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aaronpk
it assumes the links on your site are in order of preference
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mkowens
Yeah, but preference is situational.
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mkowens
Example: Logging into StackOverflow would be best done using Github because the identity space is code-related there and my social graph on Github is much more attuned to the one that I would want to immediately be able to interact with on StackOverflow.
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mkowens
Example 2: Logging into Zynga.com would be best done using Facebook because the identity space is personal-related there and my social graph on Facebook is most likely to overlap with the concept of social games.
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aaronpk
ah, but in this case your identity is actually mowens.com.
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aaronpk
it's not mowens on github or mowens on twitter
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aaronpk
it just delegates the actual authentication to some other provider, but it doesn't matter which it is. you are still you.
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mkowens
Right, but I would hope that as the indieauth system improves, it could delegate more data from the authentication provider used down to the site with which I just connected as mowens.com
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aaronpk
so the site that's trying to log you in doesn't even need to know which you used to authenticate. and indieauth.com doesn't even tell the site. (look at the sample response for indieauth.com/session)
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aaronpk
you mean like your name / email / other profile data?
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mkowens
Yeah.
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aaronpk
well ideally that should come from your domain too! marked up properly with microformats of course
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mkowens
Instead of simply being an identity delegate, it could also be a social graph delegate.
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mkowens
Most of my friends don't use FOF or XFN properly even if I do. :-P
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aaronpk
yea. social graph stuff is interesting, but one step at a time :)
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mkowens
I'm not saying it's a realistic need or desire, but it might be something to consider when working with the authentication preference concept, as it does create an interesting method for independently delegating data to a service without giving access to or revealing data you don't want shared with a service.
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mkowens
Lately, I've also been spending most of my time looking at network graphs and the intersections of network graphs over time and location, so my mind is definitely on "how do I improve personal graph use" mode.
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aaronpk
ah cool. I'd love to read about what your'e finding, are you documenting things on your site somewhere?
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mkowens
Not currently. It's a long-term side project that is not yet publicly available.
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mkowens
I'm documenting things, but I want to get the side project to a reasonable point before I start really talking too much about it publicly.
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aaronpk
ah cool
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tantek
catches up
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tantek
aaronpk - you shoudn't have to whitelist fb.me - the relmeauth consumer is supposed to handle redirects (a redirect is an implied rel-me)
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tantek
I certainly had to add some code to relmeauth.php to specifically make that work
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aaronpk
I have code that checks whether a link is a known OAuth provider, I need to add it there.
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tantek
or rather, process a URL for redirects *before* checking it
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aaronpk
unfortunately that would break Google profile URLs, since the redirected version is the URL that has a bunch of numbers in the string. Then I wouldn't know the Google account name
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tantek
I believe per HTTP / Web Architecture - you don't have much of a choice you're supposed to treat redirects like they're the real thing
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aaronpk
oh wait, I think if I verify the other direction I might be able to do that... *thinking*
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tantek
mkowens try your web address with the relmauth.php prototype to see if that handles your domain/rel-me: tantek.com/relmeauth
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mkowens
kk
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tantek
aaronpk - just tried indieauth.com with tantek.com and it worked beautifully!
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aaronpk
tantek: awesome! good to hear!!
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tantek
now you just need a logout link like the RelMeAuth prototype has ;)
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aaronpk
there is no concept of being logged in :)
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mkowens
Just logged in.
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tantek
aaronpk - yeah, I've been debating which terminology is better, "logout" or "sign-out"
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tantek
"Sign-out" is more parallel to "Sign-in"
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tantek
but more people quickly recognize "logout"
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tantek
at least that's my anecdotal assertion
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aaronpk
or rather, indieauth.com doesn't have the concept of being signed in. that would be up to the site using it
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tantek
well it does
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tantek
because it comes back with a page that says:
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tantek
You're Signed In!
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tantek
Congrats! You've signed in as http://tantek.com/
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aaronpk
heh, I should change that messge then
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tantek
I'd expect that page to have a "logout" or "sign-out" link ;)
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mkowens
Tantek: RelMeAuth prototype just recognized Twitter. How would I make it recognize the fb.me URL?
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tantek
mkowens - that's a good question. first I'd have to add FB Oauth support to relmeauth.php
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aaronpk
facebook won't work unless the RelMeAuth site handles facebook's stupid markup
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mkowens
Oh, okay. That's where aaronpk is running into an issue is on the FB redirection.
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Loqi
aaron was at Portland 1 hour 41 minutes ago.
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mkowens
Anyway, I'm heading home for the night. Have fun guys. :-)
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tantek
ttyl mkowens!
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tantek
aaronpk - added indieauth to the "example implementations" of Web sign-in: http://microformats.org/wiki/web-sign-in :)
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aaronpk
awesome!
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tantek
hey - where should I link to in the indieauth github repository for the Ruby implementation of RelMeAuth? (i.e. not the whole indieauth.com website, but just want a Ruby developer would include if they wanted to do the authing themselves - e.g. what Ward wants to do with FedWiki)
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aaronpk
ah, I haven't broken that part out into a separate gem yet.
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aaronpk
great! I'll make a repository called relmeauth soon, and it'll be easy to use, like `gem install relmeauth`
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aaronpk
how much of the oauth/relmeauth is handled by your php library? is it just things like parsing the web pages, or does it include twitter oauth client code as well?
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aaronpk
i'm wondering what sort of dependencies that module should require, as in a database, twitter client credentials, etc
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tantek
the twitter oauth client code is handled by tmhOAuth.php
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tantek
rather, it's a generic Oauth client library
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tantek
which is written quite cleanly and requires very little twitter-specific code in relmeauth.php
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tantek
I'd actually recommend tmhoauth.php for your OAuth book as well
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aaronpk
ok, I'll take a look. It's OAuth 1 only tho, right?
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tantek
looks like 1.0A
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tantek
aaronpk - the whole todo.txt thing has made me think - I wonder what the right "indieweb" solution is to to-do lists
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tantek
many (most?) to-do things I'm ok making public, in the pronoia hopes/perspective that others knowing about it may help get it done more easily
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tantek
plus there's the use case of send each other to-dos etc. via web pages
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aaronpk
well there's a crazy idea! a to-do item as a web page! seems like you could leverage git to power that in some interesting ways
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tantek
we have some examples of things like to-do items on web pages already - e.g. when someone tweets a plancast tweet that they're "planning" something - that's like a to-do on a web page (tweet permalink page)
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aaronpk
good point!
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tantek
foursquare's tips are kind of like geofenced to-do items when you add them to your to-do list on foursquare
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tantek
but they have the assumptions of repeatability
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tantek
private tips and limited count tips would be interesting - i.e. only things you can do, and only things a certain number of people can do - like tickets to an event.
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67.180.195.8
edited /Special:Log/newusers () "created new account User:Agalpern"
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agalpern
edited /2012/Guest_List (+431) "/* Creators */"
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tantek
edited /2011 (+20) "schedule"
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tantek
edited /2012 (+193) "to-do"
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agalpern
edited /2012/Guest_List (+324) "/* Apprentices */"
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agalpern
edited /2012/Guest_List (-323) "/* Apprentices */"
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agalpern
edited /2012/Guest_List (+42) "/* Creators */"
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tantek
edited /2012/Planning (+468) "some updates for 2012, note to-do on 2012 page"
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tantek
edited /Contribute (+43) "/* How to Contribute */ help with 2012"
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Loqi
[http://twitter.com/BarnabyWalters] Argh, coming up with a file upload backend that will scale to indefinite file types is tricky #indieweb http://t.co/WL0kaepP
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