#indiewebcamp 2014-03-27

2014-03-27 UTC
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tantek
KartikPrabhu - no I don't but if you want to note any specific issues / topics that we should capture on the wiki, feel free to bring them up. I'd prefer to focus on discussing/debating issues rather than the sources thereof (citations are good of course, but labeling something as someone's personal issue is not)
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aaronpk
I must not be rendering the uid that bridgy sets in my /mentions feed
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aaronpk
but, the url of the bridgy "like" is actually the URL of my tweet, which seems incorrect
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tantek
reads more scroll back
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tantek
oh dear
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aaronpk
so, the answer to your question is, yes there is a real h-entry in the wild that has no url or uid, it's here http://aaronparecki.com/mentions (I can't send you a link to it obviously cause it has no link)
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@dougmckown
@elegantthemes Do any of your themes support microformats? And can I search the themes based on that feature? #indieweb
(twitter.com/_/status/448973349809422336)
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tantek
KevinMarks gRegor` pdurbin please let's avoid criticisms of Dave Winer as a person, regardless of what he may or may not have done to any of you personally.
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aaronpk
so it's not *just* a theoretical problem, because it's a problem with my feed right now
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tantek
It doesn't help discussion of indieweb *topics*, technologies, features, etc.
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gRegor`
Sorry, I didn't mean that as a criticism actually. Just a comment.
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gRegor`
If I was in his shoes, I might have blocked me too. Not like we have any relationship.
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aaronpk
and I assume that if I managed to generate an h-entry with no uid/url then probably someone else will soon too
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tantek
gRegor`: I'm not debating whether any such actions were right or wrong.
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tantek
I just want to avoid any of us falling into the trap of debating or criticizing an argument based on criticizing or other behavior of the person making the argument.
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tantek
we're (trying to be) better than that - let's discuss ideas on their intrinsic (de)merits, not by who is making what argument or taking what position
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tantek
also - doesn't matter if others *do* criticize arguments by criticizing the people making them. we can set a better example.
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gRegor`
Understood. I wasn't even concerned with a topic of argument. It was just an offhand comment about being blocked. No grudge here
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gRegor`
I still think well of him. :)
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tantek
thanks gRegor` appreciated.
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gRegor`
But I could have made that more explicit in my remark
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tantek
and to be clear, I've made this mistake myself in the past. it's never been to my (or any of my arguments) benefit.
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tantek
aaronpk, the Bridgy example is interesting, but I guess I'm still confused by how you got the h-entry in the first place if you can't point to it
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tantek
surely you got a "source" URL in the webmention of it?
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aaronpk
yes, there is something wrong with the way i'm handling it. my point is that I still was somehow able to generate html for an h-entry that does not have a URL or UID
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pdurbin
tantek: I'm critical of Dave Winer's words, which smack of homophobia
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aaronpk
so my question is what should a consumer of a feed do if there is no url or uid
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aaronpk
a) find/make some other unique identifier, or b) treat the h-entry as invalid
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aaronpk
(other options?)
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tantek
aaronpk - how about start with a) the consumer should ignore it, and b) debug why you're generating it
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tantek
because I guess what I'm saying is, I don't see a valid use case for such h-entry's yet
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aaronpk
if the consumer ignores it, then I am going to make the consumer report the error back to the producer like how google webmaster tools has a lot of debugging tools
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tantek
and it seems like the result of a bug anyway
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aaronpk
i don't care whether it's a valid use case of h-entry or not
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aaronpk
my question is how does a consumer handle it
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tantek
my point is, if it's not a valid use case, then default ignore
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aaronpk
so if it's essentially required for an h-entry to have a uid or url, then I should report missing uid/url as an error
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tantek
no, that's not what's required
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tantek
what's required is for someone to produce a real world use-case
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tantek
absent that, default ignore
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aaronpk
you know what i'm working on, right?
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gRegor`
Perhaps of indieweb interest: thinkup.com I forgot I had an install of it. They've now made a public, hosted version of it too.
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tantek
gRegor`: last I checked ThinkUP was a) PESOS-centric (not POSSE), and b) monoculture centric (their one project was going to save everything)
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tantek
aaronpk - reader feature?
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gRegor`
I installed it years ago for the "local copy of my tweets", plus analytics
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aaronpk
http://indiewebcamp.com/mention-app is a consumer of a list of h-entrys, and it needs to know whether or not it has seen a particular entry in the feed before
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gRegor`
But I haven't kept up with it.
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tantek
definitely seems like something that can easily ignore things that don't look "real"
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tantek
but yeah, what you said, about ignore / report errors in debug mode seems fine
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aaronpk
if there is a "problem" with an h-entry, it needs to make a decision on how to handle it. I want it to be useful for people to know what is wrong with the feed rather than silently ignoring failures
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aaronpk
so it sounds like the correct behavior is that a consumer should treat either uid or url as a required field, and report it as an error if not present
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aaronparecki.com
edited /mention-app (+116) "ignore h-entry with missing uid/url"
(view diff)
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tantek
aaronpk - perhaps consider filing "problem with an h-entry" thoughts as feature requests for indiewebifyme? not every consumers of h-entry need to be error reporting / debugging validators
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aaronpk
ignoring h-entries with no url/uid is getting dangerously close to one of those being a required field
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aaronpk
but i'll leave that for another discussion
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aaronpk
as long as I know how to proceed for now
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tantek
aaronpk - ignoring it - FOR THAT APPLICATION
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tantek
!= required field for a *format*
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aaronpk
that's why I said it's another discussion :)
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tantek
well, rather, the whole notion of "required field" doesn't work
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tantek
because saying something like that in prose doesn't stop people from ignoring it
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tantek
and you end up having to figure out what to do in that case *anyway*
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aaronpk
which is where the error reporting comes in
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tantek
it is never worth thinking of any field as "required"
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tantek
it's just a bad framing
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aaronpk
so instructing consumers on how to handle the case is very important
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aaronpk
otherwise you get different implementations making different decisions and everything becomes a mess
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aaronpk
so guidance on that is useful
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tantek
"very important" ? you can't make that statement absent an important use case that demonstrates its importance
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aaronpk
i think my use case made that pretty clear
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tantek
it doesn't because yours is a (self)generation bug
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aaronpk
that's not relevant
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tantek
it is because such bugs are not use-cases
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aaronpk
as a consumer of a list of h-entrys, I had to make a decision on how to handle missing uid/url
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aaronpk
the options I saw were a) generate a unique id, or b) ignore the entry
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aaronpk
or I guess c) pretend this isn't a problem and probably have my code crash
sharplefthander and curiousjohn joined the channel
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onewheelskyward
possibly is how I'd phrase that
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onewheelskyward
But I'm an optimist.
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Loqi
snarfed: cweiske left you a message 2 hours, 9 minutes ago: linkback to my website failed (https://www.brid.gy/twitter/kyle_wm), could you re-run it? I tried to fix it
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Loqi
snarfed: cweiske left you a message 1 hour, 55 minutes ago: it worked since bridgy tried after 1 hour again
heath, KevinMarks and caseorganic joined the channel
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caseorganic
waiting in Mozilla lobby with lots of people for Homebrew website club to be let upstairs
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caseorganic
Mozilla Portland*
snarfed, demis, fmarier, tantek, tilgovi, pfenwick, lukebrooker, sparverius, pauloppenheim, iangreenleaf, bpayton, nihiser, paulcp, kylewm, bnvk, josephboyle, realzies, pasevin, CheckDavid, BjornW, mydjey, melvster, nloadholtes, KevinMarks_, hadleybeeman, nfn, ben_thatmustbeme, tahnok, jjuran, Garbee, ddysart, brianloveswords, tommorris, netweb, michel_v_, gavinc, ireheart, acegiak, pavelz, pdurbin, inimino, jden, dietrich, bear, arcatan, bret, igalic, JasonO, tomstuart, hidgw, muhh, onewheelskyward, JonathanNeal, Phae, ryana, rknLA, b0bg0d__, bigbluehat, hugoroyd, rektide, sdboyer, icco, edrex, lmjabreu, zaal, catsup, jacus, mko, otterdam, jtzl_, aaronpk, XgF, wagle, hober, saurik, walkah, reidab, the_merlin and etymancer joined the channel
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tantek
Darius - dunlaps.net
pauloppenheim joined the channel
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tantek
got SSL working on his blog at IndieWebCampSF
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aaronpk
dietrich: is IRC blocked on the mozilla guest network?
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tantek
rest of that day got full POSSE / Bridgy working on his blog
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tantek
he's using WordPress
caseorganic joined the channel
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tantek
got JetPack setup to syndicate out to a bunch of silos
heath joined the channel
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tantek
when he posts on his blog, he has a UI to optionally POSSE copies
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tantek
with URLs back to his site
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tantek
if people comment on those copies
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tantek
Bridgy sees those interactions and copies them back to his blog
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tantek
with links back to the originals too
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tantek
he showed this to his wife who runs SquarePeg foundation non-profit
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tantek
and she said - we must have this!
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tantek
because she's constantly managing their FB page etc.
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tantek
snarfed: this is where Amber's talk of "Generations" comes in
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tantek
snarfed: we're slowly making stuff work with less technical work
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tantek
darius: one of the things he did with the HTTPS stuff on the wiki was to edit those pages to make them more clear - to him as he was working on SSL support
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caseorganic
Blocking: can't access #indiewebcamp on freenode from mozilla guest network
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caseorganic
Otherwise would take notes
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tantek
Brian Alvey: worked on a platform crowdfusion
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tantek
… met Tantek 12 years ago
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tantek
… and Kevin Marks
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tantek
… who mentioned Homebrew is happening
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tantek
… Interested in meeting smart people
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tantek
… live in NYC but out in SF to work on stuff
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tantek
snarfed: IndieWebCampNYC is coming up!
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tantek
Brianalvey.com is his site
emmak joined the channel
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tantek
brought Randall with him
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tantek
Randall Bennett - I build stuff
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tilgovi
different Randall?
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tilgovi
I should turn of that highlight. No one calls me Randall on IRC.
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Loqi
definitely
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tantek
builds software that eliminates hardware in broadcast
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tantek
wants to move it all to the web
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caseorganic
I feel like I'm missing half of Homebrew club without the back hammer
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tantek
and have the client do all the work
indiewebcamp joined the channel
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dietrich
aaronpk: hm i don't know
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tantek
we figured out way to use CSS transformations to auto-scroll when content is bigger than a certain area
caseorga_ joined the channel
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tantek
Ben Werdmuller - werd.io
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tantek
… complains about twitter mentions
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caseorga_
aaronpk++
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Loqi
aaronpk has 407 karma
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aaronpk
guess irc isn't blocked? just was being weird... or werdio
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tantek
… tantek notes not to complain about twitter mentions noise ;)
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tantek
… Ben has a Knight News challenge out there
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tantek
… has been using idno for himself since June
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tantek
… day job is working for broadcasters
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tantek
… works for Latakoo
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tantek
Randall says "we'll talk"
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tantek
[thanks caseorganic for adding links in realtime :) ]
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tantek
… idno - would like people to check it out
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tantek
… it's PHP based with Mongodb (but he's fixing that)
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tantek
Amy MacKinnon - first Homebrew meeting!
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tantek
… has been wanting to come for a very long time
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tantek
… has been aware of the indieweb for a couple of years
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tantek
… didn't know what it was about til last fall
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tantek
… went to website, realized it was what she wanted to do for a while now
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tantek
… get everything off the silos etc.
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tantek
… amy-mac.com is her site
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tantek
… keeping things on her own site
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tantek
… her site is built on Jekyll
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tantek
… which she is really liking
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tantek
… having done much to advance it much lately
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tantek
… but hoping to get it more and more connected to stuff
mattmartin joined the channel
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mattmartin
hello world
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tantek
… the next thing is - setting up social media APIs to automatically tweet and all that instead of having to manually do it
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tantek
… POSSE
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tantek
… used to have it setup with Jekyll
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tantek
s/Jekyll/Wordpress
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Loqi
tantek meant to say: … used to have it setup with Wordpress
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tantek
… now has to set it up with Jekyll
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tantek
Jack - was at IndieWebCamp 2013 in PDX
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tantek
… had a lot of fun there
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tantek
… jacksenechal.com
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tantek
… not a lot going on there
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tantek
… primary use is as an OpenID platform
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tantek
… using MyOpenID
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caseorga_
tantek: can you ask amy mac about http://usslomaprieta.com/ (it's a star trek club linked from her website)
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tantek
caseorganic - you should!
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bret
!tell barnabywalters do you have your h-feed to atom feed code availble anywhere?
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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tantek
aaronpk: aaronparecki.com
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tantek
… put together IndieAuth as a provider for OpenID when MyOpenID announced shutdown
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tantek
… works a lot on the auth side of things
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tantek
… couple of weeks ago setup ownyourgram.com
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tantek
… lets you use the IG app as a client
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tantek
… and then posts it to his site in realtime within a couple of seconds
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tantek
… looks like he is doing POSSE
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tantek
… ownyourgram.com has a tutorial
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tantek
… of how to setup an API on your site
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tantek
… so that you can use other apps to post to your site
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tantek
… he wants to be able to use an app that Barnaby makes
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tantek
… to post to his own site
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tantek
… by signing into that app with his site
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tantek
… and having that app post to his site first
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tantek
… also started working on "Mention-App"
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tantek
… to get push notifications from your own site
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tantek
… similar to name mentions etc.
AmyMac joined the channel
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tantek
… micropub is the reverse of microformats
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tantek
… microformats is a way to make HTML machine consumable
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tantek
… micropub is the reverse of that, a way to create microformats entries
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tantek
… he can create a micropub endpoint on his site
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tantek
… for other apps to create content on his own site.
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tantek
… microformats + IndieAuth turns your site into an OAuth server
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tantek
… that's the idea is that you should be able to with your own site, create content in all these different servers from the own app
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pauloppenheim
caseorga_: it's http://www.usslomaprieta.org and it's frequently at my house
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tantek
Ryan: I added "find a micropub wordpress plugin" to my list
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tantek
s/list/to-do list
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Loqi
tantek meant to say: Ryan: I added "find a micropub wordpress plugin" to my to-do list
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caseorga_
pauloppenheim++
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Loqi
pauloppenheim has 1 karma
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tantek
hey caseorganic can you minute PDX?
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caseorga_
AWESEOME
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tantek
sometimes hard to hear here
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tantek
caseorganic - can you minute Alex?
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AmyMac
Whoah, who's talking about the USS Loma Prieta?
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caseorga_
tantek: minute?
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tantek
take notes
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caseorga_
AmyMac: I am
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aaronpk
leading constiturional tax reform
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AmyMac
Are you a member?
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caseorga_
Alex Linkster is here in portland working on something related to the moon is a harsh mistress and implementing it on his site as a trinary node structure with certain cells connected to other cells
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caseorga_
"is there a use case you have in mind?" snarfed
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aaronpk
... organizing groups, leaders of groups assigning tasks
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caseorga_
AmyMac: no! i didn't know it existed
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aaronpk
... currently not easy to see what other groups are doing
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caseorga_
AmyMac: and i don't live in SF, but this looks fantastic!
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aaronpk
... hard to have groups feel connections to other groups
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AmyMac
I'm just curious because I'm one of the senior staff on the ship and I was surprised to see it mentioned here
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caseorga_
"do you know of any existing groups that would use this?" - alex
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caseorga_
sorry, not alex - snarfed for the quote above
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caseorga_
alex: neighborhood associations, leaders of these groups. not formally structured
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caseorga_
bittorrent synch - bret
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aaronpk
bret.io up next
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aaronpk
bret.io is a jekyll site, done some experiments with setting it up with indieweb stuff
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aaronpk
... recently built an atom feed for yesterday's IRC feed
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aaronpk
... currently updating at random times during the day (need to fix that)
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aaronpk
... next project is a more general h-feed/h-entry to atom gateway, probably written in node
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AmyMac
@caseorga I just caught up on the logs, so now I understand why it was mentioned. It's a great club. We have a lot of fun and do a lot of stuff. Site needs a lot of work though ;-)
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aaronpk
dietrich up now
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pauloppenheim
alex is not on IRC? someone pls point him to https://gephi.org/
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aaronpk
... works for mozilla in pdx
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aaronpk
... hooking up IFTTT to every single place they support that he uses
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aaronpk
... gathering everythign into google spreadhseets, trying to figure out data ownership for non-technical people
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aaronpk
... hoping to use existing infrastrcuture and plumbing to let non-technical people do stuff wit htheir data right now
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aaronpk
... also working on firefox os, thinking a lot about the user-centric indieweb principles
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aaronpk
... hoping to do something like saving a person to your home screen of the phone so you can "launch" that person
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aaronpk
tantek: wants help with a really simple thing... a short snippet of PHP code that detects whether the device accessing the site is iOS based
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aaronpk
... use case is to use that to determine whether that person has facetime suppport
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aaronpk
... hoping to not reinvent that wheel, assuming someone has done it already
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aaronpk
bret: brad demo'd camlistore at indiewebcamp pdx in 2013, there will be an install party in pdx http://calagator.org/events/1250465835
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Loqi
Camlistore Install Fest on Monday, Mar 31, 6:00pm at Mozilla
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dietrich
tantek: people -> urls -> launchers was something that's only talked about in the last couple of days and then i saw your tweet last night. #cosmic
hanni joined the channel
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benwerd
tantek - re: iOS device detection, it really is all about the user agent. I like the look at this class because it groups by device *type*: http://mobiledetect.net/
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tantek
Joe Johnston
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tantek
… website is simpleton.com
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benwerd
but of course you could do a one-liner to grep the ua string.
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tantek
… has some stuff
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tantek
… modified version of Jekyll
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tantek
… Octopress but ripped apart and more hacker friendly.
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tantek
… working on a startup for the personal cloud space
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tantek
… starting with the UI first
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tantek
… personal clouds finally arriving this year
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tantek
… IoT etc. driving this
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tantek
… by end of the year people will understand they have a server the same way they understand they have dropbox
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aaronpk
... by the end of the year expects people to understand they have a server, like they understand they have a dropbox acct
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tantek
… launching a startup called airship
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tantek
… has also done a startup in the broadcast space
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tantek
… not to be confused with UrbanAirship
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tantek
Katie Johnson
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tantek
… website is katiejohnson.me
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tantek
… my portfolio
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pauloppenheim
www.10hacks.com
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tantek
… built in Bootstrap
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tantek
… interested in having more up to date text
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tantek
… thoughts and content
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tantek
… that I want to produce regularly
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tantek
… I'm working on allowing citizens to have access to public sector data
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tantek
… working for a company that manages city data
indie-visitor joined the channel
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tantek
… dev portal to make it easier to build apps
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tantek
… exciting to be here.
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tantek
Brian Alvey - has a question
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caseorga_
aaronpk: ^^ interesting, we should talk with katiejohnson about civic data
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tantek
… who does things like that
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tantek
… this person is
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tantek
… that
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tantek
tantek: check out IdentEngine
benwerd joined the channel
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tantek
… does not have a website
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tantek
… did indieweb back in 1995 - look at archive.org!
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AndySylvester
bret: I am on IRC, will try to monitor the discussion when you get to the brainstorm session for h-entry gateway
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tantek
… here is fortunate enough to do what he wants to do
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tantek
… inspired and wanted to see what is going on
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tantek
… interested in federated private sharing
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@benwerd
Hearing about IdentEngine as an #indieweb solution, but it seems to be stopped. Dead? http://www.identengine.com/
(twitter.com/_/status/449008384214175744)
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tantek
… has been inspired by all of you to take all of his G+ posts and move them to github
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tantek
… with a makefile etc.
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tantek
… hopefully next time!
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tantek
Jonathan Bailen (sp?)
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bret
AndySylvester: sounds good
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bret
still doing intros
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tantek
… just moved his site off of WordPress to static site this morning
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tantek
… jonbeilan.net
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tantek
… went with more DIY sort of attempt
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tantek
… got tired of being bound of different platforms owning relationships with people
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tantek
… say Tumblr did something I disagred with politically
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AndySylvester
bret: thanks, will stand by...
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tantek
… no way to move off their platform and keep relationships
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tantek
… maybe something as simple and lo-fi as a mailing list
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tantek
… I think it's goofy that RSS exists as a protocol
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tantek
… but no one uses it
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tantek
… this is my first meeting
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tantek
… not even web developer
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tantek
Hanni
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tantek
… website is hanni.me
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tantek
… don't use it much
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tantek
… another disclaimer - been involved with WordPress fairly closely … forever
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tantek
… used to be inspired by this kind of stuff
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tantek
… got involved with wordpress 10-11 years ago
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tantek
… now that actually becoming a lawyer instead
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tantek
… now intrested in this stuff in a totally different perspective
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gRegor`
Dang, I forget that WordPress is that old, heh
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tantek
… the problems we tried to solve a long time ago
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tantek
… it's Tantek's fault I'm here
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tantek
... (we're trying to solve the same problems again)
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tantek
… very interested in having control of my data on my own domain
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tantek
… rather than scattered about
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aaronpk
theodore
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aaronpk
... first time, wanted to see what you guys were doing
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aaronpk
... i don't have my own site up
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aaronpk
... but like the idea of having control over your content, posting from one place
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tantek
right
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AndySylvester
bret: I will take a look at them now
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aaronpk
emma kuo - notenoughneon.com
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aaronpk
... developing my own indieweb software
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hanni
not hanny, although very hilarious that someone has that on a WordPress.com site :)
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aaronpk
... currently trying to add micropub and oauth endpoints to try out ownyourgram.com
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hanni
aaronpk: i'd love to help with the wp plugin, I'm no dev (see above disclaimer), but ... most things can be done with good intentions and a deisre to learn
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aaronpk
knows very little about wordpress unfortunately! But happy to help on the micropub side!
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hanni
aaronpk: sounds like we might have the right mix!
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AndySylvester
bret: tried both with my site (andysylvester.com), Barnaby's service works with my site (was able to subscribe to the feed URL), Sandeep's did not return any entries.
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onewheelskyward
Is that a post-it on dietrich's head?
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@CaptainCalliope
@dietrich Huh. I didn't realize the #indieweb used passwords.
(twitter.com/_/status/449017750468689921)
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AndySylvester
bret: I took a look at Barnaby's Github account, I did not see any projects there that looked like his MF to Atom service
#
bret
ill chat him up next time we are on together
#
bret
AndySylvester: here is my idea
#
bret
you trigger on some kind of new content event (like a new post or an edit) to send a webhook or webmention to the atom gateway. this parses your h-feed and generates the updated atom feed. when that is ready, ping the pubsubhubbub hub
mattmartin joined the channel
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bret
i was thinking about having people just deploy their own gateway to some free paass
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mattmartin
anyone here willing to give some direction to a newb
#
bret
yeah mattmartin ask away!
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mattmartin
thanks, bret. So first question I have is… are there any downsides to a .io domain?
#
bret
they cost a lot
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aaronpk
$38 on gandi.net
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bret
they are actually cool because you can target any region in the world
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notenoughneon.com
edited /IRC_People (+59) "add myself to irc people"
(view diff)
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AndySylvester
bret: that sounds good, I assume this could be built to feed Barnaby's service or another service
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mattmartin
yeah, i noticed the price
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mattmartin
definitely not a bargain
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AndySylvester
bret: I need to go, I will put some notes together from the IRC log and my thoughts into a weblog post
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@jackwilliambell
For @danlyke: Indie Web. "When you post something on the web, it should belong to you, not a corporation." http://indiewebcamp.com/
(twitter.com/_/status/449023375243870208)
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bret
AndySylvester: sounds good.
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mattmartin
bret, is this mostly a west coast/portland thing?
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bret
there is a cool tech scene in portland way beyond indiewebcamp
#
bret
and, SF, well you know, its totally tech central rigth now, so there are lots of people in both places
#
bret
but there is indieweb uk ever year for the past few years
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mattmartin
yeah, that makes sense… i live in a tech deadzone
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bret
and there has been some HWC in london I htink
#
bret
check indiewebcamp.com/events for some history
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bret
mattmartin: i wasnt involved in any tech scene before portland, it has been pretty eye opening
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mattmartin
yeah, theres not a tech scene here in middle america
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mattmartin
not much of one anyway
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bret
then IRC it is!
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demisflanagan.com
edited /projects (-7) "/* idno */"
(view diff)
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@kartik_prabhu
The #indieweb or: how I learnt to stop worrying and love the #blog. Comes about a year since I went indie (http://kartikprabhu.com/article/indieweb-love-blog)
(twitter.com/_/status/449032538476929024)
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KartikPrabhu
you guys I wrote a article on the indieweb with pictures :)
KevinMarks, bnvk_ and bnvk joined the channel
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kylewm
KartikPrabhu: very nice post! and purty too
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KartikPrabhu
:D thanks
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aaronpk
hmm my browser didn't seem to load the font
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KartikPrabhu
:( in the pictures or the title ones?
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KartikPrabhu
also which browser?
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aaronpk
chrome 33.0.1750.152
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KartikPrabhu
any! boo! I tested in almost all :(
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KartikPrabhu
shouldn't it just timeout and give you a back up font?
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aaronpk
huh,refreshed and it works now
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KartikPrabhu
weird! yeah I have the same version and works in mine... oh browsers!
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aaronpk
yay awesome post!
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KartikPrabhu
thanks!! :)
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@kyle_wm
great intro to the IndieWeb for anyone I've given an incomprehensible explanation to lately http://kartikprabhu.com/article/indieweb-love-blog (http://kylewm.com/share/2014/03/27/1)
(twitter.com/_/status/449044366418378753)
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kylewm
aaronpk: in your tweet preview thingy in p3k
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kylewm
can I ask how you handle the situation where you edit the tweet and then go back and edit the original?
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aaronparecki.com
edited /Posts_about_the_IndieWeb (+181) "add kartikprabhu post"
(view diff)
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KartikPrabhu
I should really fix my webmention parsing! you nice little share looks horrendous on my site :P
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KartikPrabhu
kylewm ^^
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aaronpk
kylewm: if I edit the tweet, it locks it and doesn't update if I change the original text
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KartikPrabhu
gee thanks Loqi!
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Loqi
you're welcome
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kylewm
ah, that's smart. any way to unlock it from there?
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aaronpk
I think if I delete the whole tweet text it'll re-create it
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aaronpk
also by "lock" i just mean changing the original doesn't change the tweet
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kylewm
KartikPrabhu: lol, every time I write or receive a comment, I find there's something new to debug :)
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KartikPrabhu
yeah. somehow my webmention sender threw a hissy fit while sending metions from this last post
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KartikPrabhu
have to fix that too :)
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kylewm
aaronpk: thank you! trying not to write a poor clone of p3k, but sometimes failing ;)
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KartikPrabhu
oh well that's what we get for eating our own dog food ;)
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aaronpk
kylewm: cool!
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KartikPrabhu
kylewm: damn didn't think that was nearly 2500 words!
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kylewm
KartikPrabhu: Another interesting thing will be if if I get comments or likes on my share, bridgy will send them to your post too
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kylewm
oh... that word count sucks, it might be waaayyy off
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KartikPrabhu
oo! interesting just transmit the mention, likes to original post?
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KartikPrabhu
also bridgy will really break my webmentions!
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kylewm
wc says 1239 words
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KartikPrabhu
that's still quite a lot :P
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KartikPrabhu
decides to attack webmention parsing instead of short urls
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snarfed
ooh, KartikPrabhu, if you're prioritizing a todo list, i want to weigh in with a vote :P
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KartikPrabhu
ok shoot...
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snarfed
someone at HWC tonight tried to use bridgy publish, but her web site only had mf1, not mf2
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snarfed
so i wonder how hard it would be to add legacy mf1 (backward compatibility) to mf2py
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snarfed
nontrivial, probably
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KartikPrabhu
no there already is some
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KartikPrabhu
maybe only hCard
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snarfed
i thought so!
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snarfed
ah maybe
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snarfed
i know aaronpk and barnabywalters ran into at least one or two catches trying to make php-mf2 support both mf1 and mf2
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KartikPrabhu
aah cool... will work on that too then.
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snarfed
thanks! not high priority.
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KartikPrabhu
actually since we havr mf2py mostly working fixing my webmentions should not be hard
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kylewm
famous last words
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KartikPrabhu
"should not be hard" probably the title of my memoirs
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snarfed
KartikPrabhu: wow! reading your post now. so great!!!
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aaronpk
KartikPrabhu: i'm gonna send your post to people who ask me what the indieweb is!
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KartikPrabhu
w00t! aweomse!! :D
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Loqi
yay!
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KartikPrabhu
moar pictures always help
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aaronpk
totally
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KartikPrabhu
also inkscape is horrible
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@schnarfed
RT @kartik_prabhu: The #indieweb or: how I learnt to stop worrying and love the #blog. Comes about a year since I went indie (http://t.co/F…
(twitter.com/_/status/449054935158517761)
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@bear
RT @kartik_prabhu: The #indieweb or: how I learnt to stop worrying and love the #blog. Comes about a year since I went indie (http://t.co/F…
(twitter.com/_/status/449054999390453760)
lukebrooker and pauloppenheim joined the channel
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kylewm
need a little advice from real web developers...i want to add a background queue for processing webmentions, sending stuff to syndication, etc. outside of the regular request/reply flow (Python/Flask). google is pointing me to Celery + Redis but seems like that's overkill?
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snarfed
kylewm: yeah, celery + redis is both the right idea and also overkill
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snarfed
how about a cron job?
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aaronpk
kylewm: I really like beanstalkd
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aaronpk
it's a minimal queuing protocol based on the design of memcache
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aaronpk
that's what I use in p3k (and also that is what has been in production with the geoloqi API for a couple years)
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kylewm
snarfed: cron is an interesting minimal idea, where would you save information about the jobs being queued?
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snarfed
wherever you're storing your posts and other data
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kylewm
aaronpk: thank you, I will read up on that too
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aaronpk
it's simple enough to understand that it's not hard to use in any language, and you don't really need a whole frameworky thing on top of it (like sidekiq and I assume celery)
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kylewm
aaronpk: nice! so that seems right up my alley
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@jeena
@graue over there at #indieweb we're still working on the syndication problem. (https://jeena.net/notes/132)
(twitter.com/_/status/449072974575202304)
tantek and snarfed joined the channel
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cweiske
tantek, do you have a feed that contains articles/blog posts and not small notes?
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cweiske
wasn't there a h-feed-to-atom gateway somewhere?
#
cweiske
thanks
#
cweiske
barnabywalter's
#
cweiske
one misses the post contents
#
cweiske
and only shows the title
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KartikPrabhu
hmmm yeah i noticed
#
KartikPrabhu
it shows p-summary though
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cweiske
and the aws one doesn't work with aaronparecki's
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cweiske
articles page
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cweiske
KartikPrabhu, a proper atom feed contains the full article content
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KartikPrabhu
eh maybe. I have seen many that only have summary and link back to full post
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cweiske
that's probably for advertisement
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cweiske
so that they don't "lose" visits to their site
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KartikPrabhu
blogs by web designers
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cweiske
designer
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KartikPrabhu
hmm well not claiming that it is right/wrong just that people use RSS/Atom is that way
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KartikPrabhu
IMO if people want to use it that way then the tech should allow it instead of dictating the "correct way"
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cweiske
oh, it allows it
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cweiske
so I can't aggregate the articles from one of the main indieweb proponents in my feed reader. nice.
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cweiske
interop ftw
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jsilvestre
hi there
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jsilvestre
I really like the reading of the website so far
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jsilvestre
I'm looking at the "store" part more precisely
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jsilvestre
is there other place to watch for this specific project? like a chat room or something
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KartikPrabhu
this would be the chat room. i don't think there are project specific chats rooms
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jsilvestre
ok thank you, i'll just sit here to see if something happens then :D
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KartikPrabhu
haha... :)
carlo_au, LauraJ and julien51 joined the channel
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#
Loqi
barnabywalters: bret left you a message 8 hours, 1 minute ago: do you have your h-feed to atom feed code availble anywhere?
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barnabywalters
^^^ uh, is that actually a correct reflection of actual usage?
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barnabywalters
“You should NOT include a post per­mashort­link at the end of POSSE copies of notes that include the entire note.”
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barnabywalters
in order for original-post-discovery to work there should be one
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barnabywalters
oh actually that quote is given out of context — although it’s still not really reflective of actual usage
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pdurbin
jsilvestre: ah, so http://indiewebcamp.com/store is about about having an app store of indieweb apps. interesting
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jsilvestre
pdurbin, for personal cloud platforms that basically need a store, that's even more interesting
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barnabywalters
pdurbin: jsilvestre: yep, /store has a bunch of research and brainstorming about store formats and experience for browsing and installing server side software on servers
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jsilvestre
i'm looking at it for Cozy (http://cozy.io) even if it's not the focus at the moment, we might take part of the thinking and implementation effort at some point
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barnabywalters
jsilvestre: oh great! bnvk and I were checking cozy out
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jsilvestre
yes, bnvk mentioned us the /store in the first place
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bnvk
jsilvestre: are you from cozy?
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jsilvestre
yes bnvk
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bnvk
oh nice, are you Benjamin or Frank?
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jsilvestre
no i'm a team member, benjamin forwarded us your email about it this morning
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bnvk
awesome, glad to hear you all are into the idea :)
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jsilvestre
i am personally and suggested the team we all should be, to be fair ;-)
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jsilvestre
you will probably speak about that with Benjamin, I believe you guys should meet in a few weeks
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bnvk
Ben seemed quite interested, I need to write him back
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bnvk
that would be great to meetup, are you all based in Paris?
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jsilvestre
we are working remotely, half of the team is based in Oaris, the other half is elsewhere in France
#
bnvk
cool
#
bnvk
I'm gonna add Cozy to the wiki ;)
#
brennannovak.com
edited /store (+58) "/* Platforms */"
(view diff)
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pdurbin
jsilvestre: http://cozy.io looks interesting. I imagine it gets compared to http://owncloud.org a lot
#
jsilvestre
yes and now http://sandstorm.io/ too ;-)
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jsilvestre
it's not the same technical paradigms
#
jsilvestre
we are closer to sandstorm than to owncloud I guess
#
jsilvestre
but in a functional pov, yes, "personal cloud" platform
pfenwick, jonnybarnes and netweb joined the channel
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bnvk
jsilvestre: yes, which is why owncloud isn't on there
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jsilvestre
they are not a paas, they don't have store
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bnvk
right
#
brennannovak.com
edited /store (+2) "/* Development */"
(view diff)
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brennannovak.com
edited /store (+3) "/* Projects */"
(view diff)
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cweiske
barnabywalters, did you open source your h-feed-to-atom proxy?
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@LloydDavis
@Documentally @edent I've just posted about it here: http://perfectpath.co.uk/2014/03/27/qik-before-its-too-late-indieweb/ let me know if it helps or you can see any glaring booboos
(twitter.com/_/status/449150912159031296)
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barnabywalters
cweiske: not yet, on the to-do list :)
Sebastien-L and eschnou joined the channel
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@LloydDavis
also anyone with better skillz than me, if you can turn this into a script for everyone, much love will come your way http://perfectpath.co.uk/2014/03/27/qik-before-its-too-late-indieweb/
(twitter.com/_/status/449153932418613248)
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pdurbin
jsilvestre: hadn't seen sandstorm either. interesting
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ttepasse, Sebastien-L, CheckDavid, Kopfstein, pasevin, chloeweil, connextrum, eschnou, KevinMarks and gRegor` joined the channel
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#
ben_thatmustbeme
good morning all
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gRegor`
Morning, ben_thatmustbeme
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ben_thatmustbeme
how was the meetup last night?
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gRegor`
Me? Chicago didn't have one last night. April 9 will be the first.
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ben_thatmustbeme
i just read through the logs of it all. There are certainly plenty of projects out there that detect browser from within PHP. browscap.ini being a huge one, but thats a large file for just detecting browser
#
ben_thatmustbeme
yeah, I am up in Boston
#
ben_thatmustbeme
well I live like an hour out side Boston, but I don't really want to start a meetup until I actually find people that want to meet up. especially when I could be at home with my wife
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gRegor`
Makes sense, ben_thatmustbeme :)
#
gRegor`
Chicago will likely just be me and KartikPrabhu for the first meeting.
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ben_thatmustbeme
well at least i'm starting to make progress on my ground-up version of my site
#
kylewm
heh, trying to send webmentions to this dude, getting blocked because i'm a robot :(
#
kylewm
what are you working on ben_thatmustbeme?
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gRegor`
ben_thatmustbeme: So you decided to build from scratch instead of WordPress or something else? Or using a framework?
#
ben_thatmustbeme
something between from scratch and a framework
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gRegor`
kylewm: Like robots.txt is blocking it?
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ben_thatmustbeme
i'm actually ripping apart opencart to make my own version
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ben_thatmustbeme
as I like their MVC structure
#
ben_thatmustbeme
just throwing away all the cart portions of it
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gRegor`
Ahh, interesting
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kylewm
Yes I think so "The owner of this website (www.mrmorgan.me) has banned your access based on your browser\'s signature"
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cweiske
snarfed, I find it a bit strange that my website is liked with https://brid-gy.appspot.com/like/twitter/kyle_wm/448120218687008768/2149850018
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kylewm
got through that and then got "Pings are disabled for this post"
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ben_thatmustbeme
once I get it to a reasonably working point (at least permalinks for posts working) I'll start a github for it
#
ben_thatmustbeme
and start using it in place of my current site
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snarfed
cweiske: yup, i understand why it seems strange
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gRegor`
That's strange, kylewm. Going to the trouble of setting up webmentions, but not testing receiving them? Or really strict rules on the UA. Hm.
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gRegor`
Nice, ben.
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gRegor`
I've used CakePHP framework for a few projects and rather like it. It's fairly bulky, though.
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ben_thatmustbeme
yeah I've not played with that many, at this point opencart is what i know best. I decided to use it since thats really not the piece i'm looking to learn right now
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ben_thatmustbeme
Plus I don't want to get half way through a site and realized I don't like the framework.
#
kylewm
now trying to leave a regular comment: Forbidden
#
kylewm
nooooooo
#
gRegor`
Something seems rather messed up.
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@closetgeekshow
I gotta say I'm not down with this "IndieWeb" moniker, like it's some new trend or invention it's just the old-style web's resurgence
(twitter.com/_/status/449207285466669056)
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tantek
and this is why we have "Beyond Blogging and Decentralization" right there on the home page
eschnou joined the channel
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tantek
also - @closetgeekshow's profile links to a *.flavors.me site, not to an "old-style web" personal site. Doesn't seem like they're into IndieWeb in any way, moniker or with their own stuff.
#
barnabywalters
ha ha yeah ’cause the “old style web” totally had cross-site RSVPs
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tantek
hmm - profile does say "I breathe RSS."
#
tantek
"You think that's RSS you're breathing when you tweet? Huh." ;)
#
tantek
(apologies to Morpheus)
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barnabywalters
tantek: lol
#
tantek
love the photo aaronpk!
#
aaronpk
that was dietrich's!
#
aaronpk
came out weirdly fuzzy, but it's cool
#
tantek
there's something amazingly nerdy about doing a group photo via video connection
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aaronpk
amber got a good action shot too: http://instagram.com/p/mCKATvpNz2/
#
tantek
yes - amaze
#
tantek.com
edited /silo-quits (+280) "/* Silo quitters 2013 */ add KartikPrabhu quitting Blogger, sort"
(view diff)
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tantek
oh wow Qik is shutting down?
#
voxpelli
tantek: there’s swedish http://bambuser.com/ if one needs an alternative then
#
tantek
voxpelli - silo hopping is not really a good approach ;)
#
voxpelli
tantek: not sure I would like to try and host that myself ;)
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voxpelli
but perhaps it could be fairly easy soon with the WebRTC tech stack?
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voxpelli
tantek: WebRTC ”indie” broadcasting: https://www.webrtc-experiment.com/broadcast/
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aaronpk
adambrault helped me set up webrtc on my site
#
aaronpk
i'm not hosting the coordination server thing, but it's still pretty cool
#
aaronpk
anybody that clicks this URL will end up in a video call http://aaronparecki.com/talk
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voxpelli
aaronpk: nice, is it working well? seems like a very viable solution very soon
#
tantek.com
edited /site-deaths (+381) "add Qik shutdown, quote, sort"
(view diff)
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tantek
aaronpk - really? does it work on any mobile device or just desktop?
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aaronpk
works on mobile devices that support webrtc (i.e. not ios)
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tantek
aaronpk - is there a way to test for that? and only show a link to such devices?
#
aaronpk
test for webrtc support specifically? I suppsoe you could check in javascript
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barnabywalters
for my webRTC calling I check for (window.RTCPeerConnection || window.mozRTCPeerConnection || window.webkitRTCPeerConnection)
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bret
i have some keybase.io invites.... anyone interested in playing around with that?
#
barnabywalters
and show a SIP link if it’s not supported
#
tantek
aaronpk - I was wondering if there was anything you could do server-side and just not send the link if the client didn't support webrtc
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aaronpk
ah, you could make an educated guess based on the current support of major browsers, but that's back to maintaining a list of features and versions of browsers
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tantek
yeah that's a pain :(
#
tantek
I'm wondering if there's a quick short whitelist
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aaronpk
chrome, firefox
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tantek
e.g. Android > vX.Y. or Firefox Mobile >vX.Y
#
tantek
right
#
tantek
I'm specifically thinking about the mobile use case
#
aaronpk
ah yeah. I still need to make my /talk page send me a push notificaiton when someone joins, like a phone ringing
#
voxpelli
tantek: downside of that is if someone extends eg. Safari on iOS to support WebRTC
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aaronpk
otherwise it's more similar to video chat than a phone call
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tantek
voxpelli - nah, then you just update your code
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voxpelli
which was something that Ericsson did early on to prototype WebRTC on mobile
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tantek
cross that bridge when you get to it
#
tantek
much better to just ship something simple that works today
#
voxpelli
indie code should support indie browsers, right? ;)
#
aaronpk
indie code should support whatever you want :P
#
aaronpk
(see what I did there?)
#
voxpelli
aaronpk: for push notifications I’m currently looking at using https://pushover.net/ for a simple start
#
aaronpk
cool, pushover is pretty good. also http://www.prowlapp.com/
#
aaronpk
I use prowl for IRC notifications
#
jonnybarnes
woah, tantek's page was scary then, for a second all I could see was a big picture of his face, then it shrunk into the top corner like it should do
#
voxpelli
aaronpk: cool, I’m thinking of adding pushover to https://webmention.herokuapp.com/ somehow to get a better feel for it
#
aaronpk
voxpelli: cool! do it!
basal, bnvk and paulcp joined the channel
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bret
silly text files
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aaronpk
they implemented .well-known already?
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tantek.com
edited /site-deaths (+83) "/* Upcoming */ See also blog post about qik"
(view diff)
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bret
and then going back to humans.txt style on account of github pages
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aaronpk
wonder why they don't just let you specify your own filename for it
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bret
should used microformats ;)
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bret
aaronpk i think they want people to be able to look for the file in a common location
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bret
or have that option to look
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aaronpk
that doesn't seem useful to me
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aaronpk
think about how it work on twitter and github, those sites determine the URL
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aaronpk
commented
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bret
i saw!
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bret
way cool for realtime
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Loqi
KartikPrabhu has 15 karma
kbs joined the channel
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tantek
welcome back kbs!
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bret
KartikPrabhu++ nice post :)
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Loqi
KartikPrabhu has 16 karma
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kbs
hi tantek - great to meet you in person
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tantek
you too!
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kbs
ah, also looking for suggestions for a (less sleazy? :-) dns provider? I've been using godaddy, looking for someone who can map it to a github.io page [cf. https://help.github.com/articles/setting-up-a-custom-domain-with-pages]
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aaronpk
kbs: where is your domain registered?
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aaronpk
often domain registrars provide DNS as well
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KevinMarks_
getting apex domain support can be a pain
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ben_thatmustbeme
kbs, haha "In person"
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ben_thatmustbeme
or did you actually meet him in person
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kbs
aaronpk: Ah, should have clarified - I don't have one
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kbs
am looking for a good registrar+provider who can also cname it to my content currently hosted at kbsriram.github.io - hope that makes sense ;-)
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ben_thatmustbeme
most worth anything should be able to take care of the cname
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KevinMarks_
hover.com is a good registrar+DNS, but I ended up using amazon route53 to get apex domain working on heroku
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kbs
ben_thatmustbeme: :-) it was a pretty neat meeting at the sf-moz location yesterday
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kbs
KevinMarks_: ah, okay - thanks for that tip.
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KevinMarks_
they don't do ALIAS
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aaronpk
I like namecheap.com a lot
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KevinMarks_
haven't tried github pages though
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ben_thatmustbeme
kbs: you are the other person who got pulled in to this crowd because of KevinMarks_ comments on last weeks TWiG right?
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kbs
aaronpk: great, thanks for the pointer
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aaronpk
also gandi.net
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kbs
ben_thatmustbeme: oh yes [and thank you KevinMarks_ :)]
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tantek
speaking of which
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tantek
aaronpk could you POSSE that photo to IG and people-tag hashtag it?
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ben_thatmustbeme
yes, thank you KevinMarks_
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tantek
well done KevinMarks!
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tantek
KevinMarks++
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Loqi
KevinMarks has 11 karma
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KevinMarks_
sorry I missed you all, and hanni too
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ben_thatmustbeme
KevinMarks++ he deserves one for pulling each of us in
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Loqi
KevinMarks has 12 karma
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tantek
was that photo taken with a "soft focus" filter? everyone looks so dreamy ;)
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kylewm
Isn't there a list of domain name registrars somewhere on the wiki? Can't find it...
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KevinMarks_
that's a fun effect
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tantek
I think that was our biggest collective meeting yet
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ben_thatmustbeme
kylewm if not, perhaps there should be
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ben_thatmustbeme
most I can find is the a list of short TLDs
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tantek
kylewm - start a stub /domains article
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tantek
I think the personal is implied :)
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ben_thatmustbeme
you might want to make a page for /registrars
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tantek
that works too ben_thatmustbeme
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tantek
though I think like kylewm, the next person would first look for a "domains" page
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kylewm
tantek: I meant http://indiewebcamp.com/personal-domain already exists, and is linked to from several places
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tantek
oh cool
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kylewm
oh, and already redirected from domain
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ben_thatmustbeme
if you really want to start somewhere (and probably cut down the list a lot, ICANN has a full list of approved registrars http://www.icann.org/registrar-reports/accredited-list.html
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ben_thatmustbeme
but i think you'd spend more time sorting through the list than its worth
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tantek.com
edited /personal-domain (+62) "see also"
(view diff)
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kylewm
ben_thatmustbeme: I was thinking start from the other direction ... registrars I've heard people around here recommend :)
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kylewm
namecheap.com, name.com, gandi.net
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tantek.com
edited /personal-domain (+10) "/* See Also */ DNS"
(view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme
yeah, it can be helpful if you want a specific TLD to start with that list though, should probably at least link it in the wiki page
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tantek.com
edited /dns (+103) "/* See Also */ more"
(view diff)
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tantek.com
edited /short-domains (+113) "see also"
(view diff)
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tantek.com
edited /domain_name_registrar (+10) "see also dns"
(view diff)
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kylewm
ben_thatmustbeme: good call
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tantek.com
edited /web_hosting (+81) "more see also"
(view diff)
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tantek
kylewm, ben_thatmustbeme add providers you know of people actually using to this: http://indiewebcamp.com/domain_name_registrar
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tantek
feel free to add opinions on support as well
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kylewm
Thanks for stubbing it all out!
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bret
KevinMarks_++
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Loqi
KevinMarks has 13 karma
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tantek
How does Loqi know to strip trailing _?
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Loqi
is done
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kbs
[thanks for the dns suggestions folks - hover.com seems adequate for my needs
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kylewm.com
edited /domain_name_registrar (+260) "/* Registrars */ added some registrars and opinions/recommendations"
(view diff)
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kylewm.com
edited /domain_name_registrar (+10) "/* Opinions/Recommendations */"
(view diff)
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kylewm.com
edited /domain_name_registrar (+12) "/* Registrars */ alphabetize"
(view diff)
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kylewm
tantek: should we even list GoDaddy?
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tantek
kylewm - feel free to list an opinion about GoDaddy :)
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tantek
links to articles etc.
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tantek.com
edited /domain_name_registrar (+76) "/* Registrars */ which to include"
(view diff)
paulcp joined the channel
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kylewm.com
edited /domain_name_registrar (+159) "/* Criteria */ adding some criteria"
(view diff)
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aaronpk
dietrich: is that homebrew photo actually that fuzzy or do you have a non-fuzzed version?
barnabywalters and caseorganic joined the channel
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kylewm.com
edited /User:Kylewm.com (+306) "/* Todo */ recs from Ryan and Aaron"
(view diff)
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KartikPrabhu
catches up on lgos
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dietrich
aaronpk: it's actually that fuzzy. i have no idea why :(
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caseorganic
comfirmed: harvard berkman center will host indiewebcamp in oct 2014
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aaronpk
aw ok. we'll use my iphone next time :)
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aaronpk
dietrich: mind if I post it to instagram?
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dietrich
aaronpk: sure, the license is stegonagraphically encoded in the image, by viewing the image you have already agreed to all terms.
demis joined the channel
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caseorganic.com
moved /2014/MIT to /2014/Cambridge "Changed venue from MIT to Harvard."
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kbs
heh
JasonO joined the channel
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kylewm.com
edited /domain_name_registrar (+108) "/* Criteria */"
(view diff)
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kbsriram.com
edited /IRC_People (+54) "score one more for the indieweb"
(view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme
caseorganic: I will be there
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kbs
Is it correct to assume that in indieauth, there's provider-specific 'magic' urls to find suitable reverse rel="me" links on the provider's page?
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kbs
The related question is - do such (any?) providers also have ways to embed key urls - it strikes me that it might be a way to gain 'confidence' in a key obtained from any one site. (some sort of public-key analog for indieauth)
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kbs
What I'm vaguely getting at is
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kbs
is there already some work around automated validation/proof that a given fingerprint is really from person X? [eg: a special rel=foo link that points to (say) a post on twitter that contains key material, etc.]
basal and tantek joined the channel
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KartikPrabhu
I just got the following nugget in an indieweb discussion "even for indiweb you will still end up hosting your content on a webserver which is a thirdparty. so again you technically don't own your data. so for a true indiweb you need to host data on your own servers"
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KartikPrabhu
interesting... elaborate?
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aaronpk
since it's the indie*web*, not indie everything, the important part is to own your web identity
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aaronpk
which basically means own the URLs
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tantek
ooh - good answer aaronpk
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aaronpk
as long as you control the URLs, you can move between backend providers as you wish
eschnou joined the channel
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tantek
catches up on logs
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aaronpk
you are in control of your online identity if you own the URLs
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tantek
dietrich++ for "license is stegonagraphically encoded in the image" LOL!
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Loqi
dietrich has 4 karma
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tantek
so THAT'S why it's "fuzzy" - all that license encoding ;)
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KartikPrabhu
aaronpk: gotcha!
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kbs
is a also fan of the SELFIE approach - 'Syndicate Everything from Local Files' :-)
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ben_thatmustbeme
still thinks of playing Perfect Dark on N64 every time he sees the word "Syndicate"
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ben_thatmustbeme
I miss that game
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aaronpk
SELFIE! lol!!
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tantek
kbs you're missing a few letters: Syndicate Everything from Local Files I Edit
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kbs
tantek: love it.
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tantek.com
edited /web_hosting (+712) "start FAQ with q that KartikPrabhu got, and aaronpk's answer in IRC"
(view diff)
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tantek
thanks KartikPrabhu, aaronpk. added, please feel free to edit: https://indiewebcamp.com/web_hosting#Is_using_3rd_party_hosting_still_indieweb
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@bear
OH: "Syndicate Everything from Local Files I Edit" aka SELFIE - via @t and #indieweb IRC
(twitter.com/_/status/449268447936282624)
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tantek
hey now bear, attribute kbs for that please - it was his idea ;)
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@radiocolin
RT @bear: OH: "Syndicate Everything from Local Files I Edit" aka SELFIE - via @t and #indieweb IRC
(twitter.com/_/status/449268565229989888)
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kbs
actually, I think tantek added the cherry on that retronym :-)
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tantek.com
created /User:Kbsriram.com (+29) "stub with URL"
(view diff)
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tantek
speaking of - kbs, feel free to expand on your user page ;)
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kbs
ah, cool. Thanks for the pointer
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tantek
you linked to it from the /irc-people page :)
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tantek
I just clicked on that and started typing ;)
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@bear
oops - wrong originator, it was kbs (http://indiewebcamp.com/User:Kbsriram.com): OH: "Syndicate Everything from Local Files I Edit" aka SELFIE
(twitter.com/_/status/449269340383481856)
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kbs
I guess I need to actually pay attention to the wiki edits :-)
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bear
the Recent Changes page is my fav
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tantek
huh - here's another MySQL tale of woe for those who say, have blogs that use a MySQL backend, and say, use shared hosting: https://twitter.com/christi3k/status/448270028484263936
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@christi3k
Good news: My blog is back up. Bad news: MySQL barfed all over the table holding my posts. /me cries
(twitter.com/_/status/448270028484263936)
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@christi3k
And I'm pretty sure that happened when Rackspace hard reset my machine due to swapping.
(twitter.com/_/status/448270919341858816)
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aaronpk
oh man
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aaronpk
fwiw postgres doesn't have that problem :)
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tantek
so there you go, another reason why you can't trust databases / MySQL ;)
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@ozten
RT @bear: oops - wrong originator, it was kbs (http://indiewebcamp.com/User:Kbsriram.com): OH: "Syndicate Everything from Local Files I Edit" aka SELFIE
(twitter.com/_/status/449269764968300544)
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kbs
(thanks bear :) but still think tantek added that extra zing - so it's all good.
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bear
kbs - it's important to get the sequence correct even for things that are improved and iterated on
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tantek
so - how do you protect against this if you're using WordPress? https://twitter.com/christi3k/status/448342666325921793
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@christi3k
Okay, so part of the problem with my blog today was that some plugin has been inserting bogus rows (~700k of them) into my posts table.
(twitter.com/_/status/448342666325921793)
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@christi3k
Other problem was that caching broke after some update sometime ago and I hadn't noticed.
(twitter.com/_/status/448342900330745856)
cweiske joined the channel
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KartikPrabhu
tantek: you recommend using flat files instead of dbs?
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bear
you can only know about the "inserting bogus rows" issue if you add metrics for database specific things and monitor logs - something that even seasoned ops folk don't do
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bear
using a database works if you need what a database offers - searching and grouping
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aaronpk
database barely offer searching, you really need a search app for that
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bear
<soapbox state="off" />
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bear
well, for a lot of folks, searching via a database is easier - especially now with key/value stores
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aaronpk
(assuming you mean full text search)
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tantek
bear: I agree with that only if you use db as a cache for searching/grouping, hence: http://indiewebcamp.com/databases-antipattern#Caching_ok
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bear
actually I was waving-hands at the type of search - most use databases for tag or key searches
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bear
yea, database as a tool to make your life easier
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tantek
as a caching layer, DBs are fine. thus hard reset = dump the DBs and rebuild from actual reliable storage
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cweiske
aaronpk, is there a way to follow your articles from a normal feed reader?
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KartikPrabhu
aah so use dbs as meta storage for searchign etc... an use files for actual content?
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cweiske
tantek at least has an atom feed
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bear
KartikPrabhu - yes
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aaronpk
cweiske: I thought I also had an atom feed
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cweiske
it's not linked in your html
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KartikPrabhu
already does that with articles... should do with notes too maybe
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aaronpk
huh, where did that go
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kylewm
KartikPrabhu: you mean, articles == flat files, notes are in the DB?
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KartikPrabhu
yeah as of now
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aaronpk
not sure how that tag went missing, but it's linked from http://aaronparecki.com/pages
#
aaronpk
(thank you weechat for preventing me from spamming IRC with 30 lines of code from my clipboard just now)
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kylewm
!me checks to see if aaronpk's feed still works in feedly... looks cold in PDX
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bear
for me they are all flat files with redis holding the relations built up from processing tags in the flat files
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aaronpk
i haven't actually looked at it in a reader in a while
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tantek
cweiske - I think I saw you asked about articles vs. notes? I include the ActivityStreams Atom object-type element / markup extension for any consumers that want to distinguish between those post types based on an existing spec.
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cweiske
aaronpk, your feed looks fine
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tantek
i.e. any Atom feed reader could (should?) support consuming AS Atom extensions and give the user the option for "only articles" etc.
#
@wraithgar
RT @bear: oops - wrong originator, it was kbs (http://indiewebcamp.com/User:Kbsriram.com): OH: "Syndicate Everything from Local Files I Edit" aka SELFIE
(twitter.com/_/status/449273330265112576)
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cweiske
tantek, tt-rss unfortunately does not support it
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tantek
KartikPrabhu: yes. flat files for reliable storage. and once you need caching or any other perf improvements, dbs are an option: http://indiewebcamp.com/databases-antipattern#Premature_Optimization
#
tantek
cweiske - seems reasonable to file an issue for them to support it - since it's in a published open spec
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cweiske
oh, I know the author
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tantek
even better!
#
cweiske
no. he won't implement unless I send a patch
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kylewm
cweiske: fox?
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kylewm
he's a prickly one
#
cweiske
typical russian if i may say that
#
cweiske
we've got another one in #pear
#
cweiske
same type ...
#
cweiske
citing myself
#
cweiske
"I opened a bug reportâžš and got the not so encouraging response that I should fix that myself since the author was not willing to support "terminally lazy people""
#
kylewm
good outcome!
#
tantek
Turkish political cartoon about silos / data-export: https://twitter.com/ceyhan_ulus/status/449262343151570944
#
Loqi
[@ceyhan_ulus] Taşınıyorum!!!!
#
tantek
"Taşınıyorum" means literally "I'm moving!"
#
tantek
and the "N'oluyor burada?" means literally "What's going on here?"
#
gRegor`
Terminally lazy? Dang, that's kinda rude.
#
tantek
gRegor`: well it is possible for laziness to be a terminal illness. though I think that's presuming a lot.
#
tantek
!tell barnabywalters hickup with http://waterpigs.co.uk/services/webmention-io-comments/ ? I'm seeing many fewer (or no) results today on URLs that had lots of results yesterday
#
Loqi
Ok, I'll tell him that when I see him next
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ben_thatmustbeme
now to device some intelligent way of formatting my seo urls
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KartikPrabhu
whats a seo url?
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ben_thatmustbeme
seo = search engine optimized
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tantek
ben_thatmustbeme: around here we just call them "slugs" :)
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ben_thatmustbeme
I don't want my URLs to just be index.php?route=blog/posts&id=5
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tantek
and that's just good URL design
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tantek
for *users*
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KartikPrabhu
"slugs" yes i get it! :)
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ben_thatmustbeme
thats the first time i've heard that term
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KartikPrabhu
i think of thoise as more "human-readable" than "seo optimised"
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ben_thatmustbeme
yeah, its more of writing a nice little class to do the translation for me
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caseorganic
tantek++ for translating that comic
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Loqi
tantek has 30 karma
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ben_thatmustbeme
probably a better way to think of it
#
tantek
some notes here on URL design: http://indiewebcamp.com/permalinks
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caseorganic
tantek: it's pretty incredible to see twitter make it into political cartoons
#
tantek
indeed
#
tantek
KartikPrabhu: yes, human-optimized is a better way to design than SEO
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ben_thatmustbeme
pokes around at everyone else's sites for ideas since on slug format
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onewheelskyward
Good for seo, bad for humans, sometimes.
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onewheelskyward
Like the slugs that give away the entire article.
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kylewm
ben_thatmustbeme: one thing i learned from these folks -- consider making the URL uniquely identifiable without the slug, and have the slug just be for humans. so if you went to example.com/20140227/1/blog-post-title or example.com/20140227/1/edited-blog-post-title, it would redirect to the same place
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kylewm
but not everyone does that -- waterpigs.co.uk for articles, the slug is the identifier
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KartikPrabhu
onwheelskyward: those are just bad slugs then
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KartikPrabhu
onewheelskyward ^^
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ben_thatmustbeme
yeah, thats why i was doing, the only issue is, originally i was going to go by post_id
#
ben_thatmustbeme
but i'm liking the idea of just using YYYY/DDD/#/title or YYYY/MM/DD/#/title
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tantek
we discussed slugs and mutability in the channel a few days ago (last week?)
#
KartikPrabhu
last week yes
#
tantek
there's definitely enough there to deserve a writeup
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onewheelskyward
KartikPrabhu Indeed.
#
tantek
KartikPrabhu: do you remember when? dig up the IRC permalink?
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onewheelskyward
I love it when I can see misspellings in the slug, though.
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KartikPrabhu
aah will attempt
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tantek
we should start a /slug stub article with the various points discussed and opinions
#
kylewm
was that when KartikPrabhu was deciding between ID vs. algorithmic urls?
#
tantek
I think so?
#
Loqi
it is probable
#
tantek
this won't be the last time this subject comes up
#
tantek
and it's worth capturing the collective wisdom of this community
#
gRegor`
I'm updating /permalinks with some more examples
#
tantek
great
#
KartikPrabhu
still cant get dates working in Django :|
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kylewm
KartikPrabhu: I didn't hear what happened with that. the generated SQL worked if you ran it manually, but no results in Django?
#
KartikPrabhu
and the SQL definitely gives the correct month I am loking for
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kylewm
how frustrating
#
tantek
was there a link missing from that tweet?
#
KartikPrabhu
no the tweet doesnt have it either
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gregorlove.com
edited /permalinks (+546) "/* Falcon */ Added WordPress examples"
(view diff)
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KartikPrabhu
here is where i asked for short url type advice: http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2014-03-20/line/1395365314
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KartikPrabhu
lol. the missing URL in the tweet was my post :P
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demis
sorry folks, bit rusty with Idno on my phone...fixed
#
gregorlove.com
edited /permalinks (+84) "/* WordPress */ Added taproot"
(view diff)
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demis
yeah sharing that one from earlier - very nice KartikPrabhu
#
KartikPrabhu
thanks :)
#
gregorlove.com
edited /permalinks (+104) "/* Taproot */ articles"
(view diff)
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gRegor`
There's a start on some permalinks updates. Maybe it would be better to split them out by domain instead of platform? Since most of us are using different platforms anyway.
#
gRegor`
I thought WordPress would be a good one since so many sites use it, and a few IWCers do.
cweiske joined the channel
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tantek
wow. that's a great summary of how we can out do the UX of silos.
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KartikPrabhu
UI/UX wise i thought it was great that users needed only one page to do everything. It means that the FB UI/UX now is stupider
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kylewm
whoa, "This is truly a nightmare scenario for any CEO: do you take the risk and proceed with the better user experience/product at the expense of short term numbers" ... that should have a VERY easy answer
#
KartikPrabhu
apparently not so easy
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kylewm
that /databases article + the fact that my site just converted curly quotes to â€Å“ and â€ï¿½ really freaking me out about MySQL
#
aaronpk
yay encoding issues
#
KartikPrabhu
yeah that happens
#
KartikPrabhu
I had to debug a webmention because of a mdash
#
KartikPrabhu
was very hard to track that one
#
KartikPrabhu
worries that mf2py is not deconding/encoding currently at the moment...
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gRegor`
Converting latin1 to utf8 can be tricky
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kylewm
<firstmistake>I'd hoped py3k & having all the tables in UTF8 would mean I wouldnt have to think about encodings </firstmistake>
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gRegor`
This is specific to Nucleus CMS, but the code could be adapted pretty easily, if you need to convert character encodings, kylewm: https://github.com/gRegorLove/nucleus-cms-to-utf8
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tantek
oh hey MySQL and encodings - yay!
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Loqi
yay!
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gRegor`
Which relies heavily on https://github.com/neitanod/forceutf8
#
KartikPrabhu
kylewm: doesn't python3 do this correctly. converting form unicode to byte strings?
#
kylewm
Yes, I thint it makes everything unicode unless you explicitly want a byte string for some reason
#
KartikPrabhu
but then you should be converting to byte string with utf8 encodings to store in your db
#
kylewm
crumbs
#
KartikPrabhu
is that not what you're supposed to do?
#
kylewm
maybe that was the wrong emoticon -- I'm not sure, I need to (re)learn about encodings apparently
#
KartikPrabhu
i might have it all wrong... don't listen to me. I am even afraid to see if i am doing it right
#
KartikPrabhu
deep deep rabbit hole
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gRegor`
I am pretty familiar with encodings and converting them. Let me know if I can help.
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gRegor`
One of the simplest routes I've seen is perform a mysqldump, search and replace the charset in the create table statements to be utf8, use iconv to convert to utf8, then use the dump to recreate the tables.
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gRegor`
Also alter the database to set its charset to utf8, so all future tables should default to that.
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KartikPrabhu
yeah i have mysql in utf8 but I am not sure I am encoding everywhere when my python talks to the db and so on. have most large holes plugged but there might be smaller leaks :)
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kylewm
thanks gRegor`
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kylewm
I'd probably unwisely converted them from latin to UTF8 without the dump/reload step
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kylewm
but not sure why new unicode going in would get screwed up
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designdream
i hate char sets!
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julien51
Ok, if anyone is interested in seeing how you can subscribe to Microformats (h-feed in particular), with Superfeedr, feel free to check this post http://blog.superfeedr.com/indieweb-microformats-fragments-subscriptions/ cc barnabywalters tantek
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julien51
[also, thanks to voxpelli, webmentions should work :)]
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cweiske
the indiewebcamp wiki does not add link headers exhibiting its webmention endpoint :/
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aaronpk
they're in the HTML right?
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cweiske
they are
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aaronpk
good enough
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cweiske
but I still only do a HEAD request
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cweiske
to get the link
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cweiske
to save bandwidth
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aaronpk
whose?
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cweiske
I don't want to parse 100k html
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aaronpk
you could always fetch 1k html at a time until you find the <link> tag if you really wanted to
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aaronpk
is that *really* something you need to be concerned about though?
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aaronpk
bandwidth doesn't really seem like a scarce resource these days
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cweiske
I linked to the wiki in one of my blogposts, and loqi did not notify
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kylewm
julien51++ blog post looks awesome
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Loqi
julien51 has 2 karma
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cweiske
aaronpk, apparently it is scarce enough for tantek to doom atom feeds
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aaronpk
hah touche
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julien51
and with that, good night!
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Loqi
ciao
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kylewm
unicode disaster averted, for now. I was calling response.content (bytes) rather than response.text (string). cc KartikPrabhu, gRegor`
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gRegor`
Good to hear
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tantek
I have a feeling as more indieweb folks implement integrated readers, we're going to figure out solutions to the problems that julien51 brings up
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tantek
solutions which provide actual real world incentives to indie web site owners / creators / maintainers
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tantek
right now, I've deprioritized a lot of stuff (e.g. subtome, h-entry PuSH etc.) because there is no apparent benefit to me
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tantek
or rather, I've prioritized working on things which show direct benefits
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tantek
maybe those of you with integrated readers working can provide an analysis of julien51's post and see how maps to your needs?
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tantek
is anyone here actually consuming PuSH (of any variety) on their own indie web site?
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@panjidrama
@Surmulot Alors justement, je veux bien des infos. Parce que j’essaie de voir un peut ce que vaut l’Indiewebcamp, et faut passer par l'IRC
(twitter.com/_/status/449304437967040512)
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tantek
btw speaking of hosting, just saw these two blog posts by Brent Simmons with real world scenarios / analysis of different hosting options/levels:
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KartikPrabhu
tantek: re: indiereaders. I do think having our own readers on our own site is the way to go. probably connected via mentions and micopub for noting/replying. we'll surely get to those if someone feels motivated enough... babysteps :)
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aaronpk
too many things!
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aaronpk
I really want to make more progress on selfoss
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aaronpk
but it's not a small project
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tantek.com
edited /web_hosting (+288) "/* Articles */ add Brent Simmons blog posts"
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cweiske.de
edited /feed (+107) "/* Criticism */ debunk size myth."
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tantek
apples and oranges cweiske - you're comparing different content
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tantek
point still stands, same content with h-feed markup < same content with Atom markup
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tantek
the HTTP requests thing is orthogonal to format
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KartikPrabhu
tantek: there does seem to be a number of people who want to publish only links or links+summary to articles on their homepage (including me). The RSS/Atom way would be to just have those and a separate RSS file with full articles for syndication. But with h-feed one seems to be forced to use more requests or have all articles as full text.
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tantek
KartikPrabhu: then just have a separate /feed.html page
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tantek
feed.html with h-feed will be more efficient (smaller) than feed.xml in Atom
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tantek
that's the point
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KartikPrabhu
That is my leading thought too
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tantek
when you hold all other variables constant, h-feed is more efficient than Atom
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tantek
that's the problem with cweiske's example, he's not holding all other variables constant
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tantek
still I'm surprised that 11x HTTP requests is ONLY 2.26x ;)
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KartikPrabhu
oh i don't agree with cweiske's example at all
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tantek
that too me really demonstrates the efficiency
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tantek
s/too/to
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Loqi
tantek meant to say: that to me really demonstrates the efficiency
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KartikPrabhu
control parameters and all that
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tantek
right. you know, science. ;)
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KartikPrabhu
if you have a h-feed (with only titles) with a u-uid link to the full feed page would that be a good solution?
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KartikPrabhu
or should we use rel="alternate"
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tantek
oh that would be a very good use of u-uid inside an h-feed
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tantek
we should document that use-case on the h-feed page
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tantek
great idea
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tantek
good way to do canonical h-feed discovery
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KevinMarks
Hmm. I have a degenerate feed on my home page
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KevinMarks
As it is just links
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tantek
Kevinmarks - links only? summaries only?
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aaronpk
has a one-sentence summary of the most recent 3 articles on his home page
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KevinMarks
And titles
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KartikPrabhu
has title+date+summary+photo on home page an archive pages
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KevinMarks
Reading scrollback, encoding is a pain because the whole tool chain needs to get it right
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KevinMarks
It's not just databases that have assumptions, it's languages, libraries and even browsers
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KevinMarks
Safari doesn't default to utf8, for example
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KevinMarks
PHP had had different default encodings in different versions
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caseorganic.com
edited /2014/Cambridge (+107) "Changed Venue from MIT to Berkman Center at Harvard"
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KevinMarks
Yay caseorganic
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Loqi
woot
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caseorganic
KevinMarks: yeah! really happy to have Berkman. Room for 20, so it will be small and productive like the SF one
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pdurbin
nice. I work in Cambridge
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caseorganic
pdurbin: fantastic! let me make the guest list page. would love to have you rsvp before event fills
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pdurbin
I'll check my calendar
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pdurbin
caseorganic: I listened to this today and it was great: 5by5 | In Beta #90: We Want Our 2003 Back - http://5by5.tv/inbeta/90
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caseorganic
pdurbin: thanks so much! glad you liked it!
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pdurbin
very good overview of indieweb
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caseorganic
pdurbin: i'm going to do a shorter intro to indieweb with willowbl00 (she's our berkman center contact and also works at mit media lab right now) anything missing from that podcast you'd like included in it?
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caseorganic
pfenwick: hello!
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KevinMarks
Oh, so a smaller room at Berkman? I've been to events the run at the law school that have lots more space
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pdurbin
caseorganic: nope. feature complete. ship it
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KartikPrabhu
tantek: re to very earlier discussion on fragment level comments and having links to fragments somewhere. I just linked the titles of each section in the latest post: http://kartikprabhu.com/article/indieweb-love-blog
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KartikPrabhu
might do something about fragment level webmentions in the future
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@Surmulot
@panjidrama dans l'ordre je vais checker indieWebcamp, tu vas choper Androirc ou une app équivalente selon ton droguiste iPhone ou win 8
(twitter.com/_/status/449314007665889280)
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pdurbin
caseorganic: no results for http://indiewebcamp.com/Special:Search?search=willowbl00 ... dunno who that is
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caseorganic
pdurbin: she's not on the wiki yet.
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caseorganic
Does anyone know Jonathan Zittrain personally? Would be an interesting invite to IndieWebCamp Cambridge
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caseorganic
And we do need to remember to invite Warren Ellis to IndieWebCamp UK
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KevinMarks
I've met zittrain a few times
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KartikPrabhu
ooo Warren Ellis.... nice
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caseorganic
KevinMarks: think he'd be interested? He's part of the Berkman center. We might be able to get the event added to the Berkman page
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KevinMarks
We can ask
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KevinMarks
Doc Searls is a Berkman fellow too
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caseorganic.com
edited /Events (+18) "/* Upcoming */ Changed MIT to Cambridge"
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caseorganic
KevinMarks: ah, that would be great
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caseorganic
KevinMarks: re: Doc Searls
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kylewm.com
edited /permashortcitation (+364) "/* Criticism */ Bridgy false positives looking for short citations"
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kylewm.com
edited /permashortcitation (+610) "/* More thoughts on use of */ more IRC thoughts about PSCs"
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kylewm.com
edited /permashortcitation (+64) "/* More thoughts on use of */ more context for snarfed quote"
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kylewm.com
edited /permashortcitation (+3) "/* Criticism */"
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KevinMarks
Wait, so twitter multiple images per tweet only work on updated mobile apps?
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KevinMarks
Silos within silos
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tantek
in re-reading Dustin's post about FB and UX, it seems there are soom good clues there for IndieWeb reader UX: http://dcurt.is/facebooks-predicament
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kbs
newbie question - are the discussion pages on the wiki reasonable places to ask for feedback on ideas (or work that's already been done) or is there a better approach you'd recommend?
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tantek
kbs - discussion pages don't work very well on wikis - they typically get ignored and neglected
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tantek
discussion is best here in IRC
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kbs
tantek: cool - thanks for the tip
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kbs
So, before I blather on - the general area to do with an indieweb proof-of-ownership of pgp keys, without needing things like keybase. Someone stop me before I go on a long discourse, with pointers to work already done?
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kbs
okay then :-) The thought is to piggyback on a technique thats being used informally already - people tweet their fingerprint (cf. https://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Atwitter.com+pgp+fingerprint+-php) to add confidence that they really are the owners of a key.
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tantek
kbs - I suppose start with the use case you're trying to solve
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kbs
The use-case is - I get a fingerprint from someone through email, web-site, etc. - how do I increase confidence that it's really their key
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kbs
So the thought is: step 1. Someone provides a key [say] on their canonical page using the standard "key", etc microformat.
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kbs
step 2. They also provide something like (say) <a href="..." rel="key-fingerprint"> pointing to pages from one or more "major" silo'ed providers.
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kbs
The idea here is this link indicates a "proof", approximately like how one might add a rel="me" link as used by indieauth.
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kbs
step 3. A validator just pulls out the raw content from the target page, and searches for a fingerprint claimed by the canonical page.
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kbs
The validator might [similar to indieauth] only choose to examine specific providers, that lets it identify the silo author from a page, with a degree of confidence
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kbs
finally, It then presents the list of authors (from each silo'ed site it understands) as a measure of confidence that that key. [eg: this fingerprint was found in @t's stream, tantek's g+ page, etc.]
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tantek
fingerprints and confidence aren't really a use-case. secure authenticated communication would be a use-case.
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tantek
fingerprints are just plumbing
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tantek
users don't care about fingerprints
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kbs
That's true - this is mostly about the plumbing
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tantek
"mostly about the plumbing" is usually a bad way of designing or solving problems
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tantek
this is why it's important to start with a user-centered use-case, absent any mention of plumbing
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tantek
otherwise you get solutions looking for problems
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kbs
gotcha. It starts from - how do I securely communicate with a person, given their canonical weburl
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KartikPrabhu
kbs: maybe useful to verify webmentions from trusted sources?
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tantek.com
edited /reader (+1160) "/* Brainstorming */ Integrated Activity Reading deductions from dcurtis blogpost"
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kbs
KartikPrabhu: ah, nice
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tantek
kbs - to be clear, is this about security/privacy/confidentiality or authentication?
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KartikPrabhu
good question
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tantek
i.e how do you know the person you're communicating with is the person you think it is
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tantek
they're related but not the same problem
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kbs
yep - it's specifically about authentication
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caseorganic.com
created /2014/Cambridge/Guest_List (+5055) "Added IndieWebCamp Cambridge Guest List Page"
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tantek
and authentication can potentially be easier to solve than a full end to end encryption/privacy
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tantek
per, solve a simpler problem first
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tantek
a-ha ok then authentication it is
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tantek.com
edited /communication (+304) "Additional Use Cases, add Authentication"
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tantek.com
edited /messaging (+33) "communication"
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pdurbin
caseorganic: is that Cambridge event free? I don't see how much it costs at http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/Cambridge
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tantek.com
edited /messaging (+243) "brainstorming, subhead IndieWeb Messaging vs. IndieWeb Authentication"
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tantek
kbs - I've tried to capture what I think you're getting at from a high level here: http://indiewebcamp.com/messaging#IndieWeb_Authentication
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kbs
tantek: great - going through your edits and the pages - appreciate the crisp summaries :-)
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KartikPrabhu
tantek: should I start a Brainstorming section on hfeed to document the u-uid idea?
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tantek
kbs, sometimes it helps for someone more clueless (me in this case) to try to summarize at a high level to see if the concept is being communicated ;)
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tantek
KartikPrabhu: yes please do, starting with the use-case you described
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caseorganic
pdurbin: yes, it is free
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caseorganic.com
edited /2014/Cambridge (+19) "/* IndieWebCampCambridge 2014 */"
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caseorganic.com
edited /2014/Cambridge/Guest_List (+2) "/* Venue Capacity: 20 */"
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pdurbin
caseorganic: I might put "tentative" next to my name on the guest list. I have two little kids and often these things end up being game day decisions.
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caseorganic
pdurbin: got it! thanks!
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caseorganic
!tell dangillmor IndieWebCamp Cambridge is a go! Here's the link: http://indiewebcamp.com/2014/Cambridge At Berkman Center
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Loqi
Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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caseorganic
Loqi: thanks
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caseorganic.com
edited /2014/Cambridge (-140) "/* Questions for Organizers */"
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KartikPrabhu
eh... how do I enter some code in the wiki?
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tantek
KartikPrabhu, <pre> usually works
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KartikPrabhu
aah ok. should be added to editing help