#indiewebcamp 2015-06-19

2015-06-19 UTC
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@FromTheWastes Bioflash Short Stories by @nrburnette – What are they?... https://fromthewastes11811.wordpress.com/2014/11/01/bioflash-short-stories-by-n-r-burnette-what-are-they/ #amreading #amwriting #indieauth # https://twitter.com/FromTheWastes/status/611685041308069888/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/611685041308069888)
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kylewm.com edited /Red_Wind (+221) "/* IndieWeb Examples */" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /next-hwc (+0) "next" (view diff)
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kylewm.com uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:friendica-screenshot-2015-06-18.png]]""
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kylewm.com created /Friendica (+467) "stub with screenshot" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /Events (+2508) "update what's next, archive old events" (view diff)
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tantek !tell gRegorLove when you have a few moments, could you create the HWC event pages for 2015-07-01, -15, -29 ? Thanks!
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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kylewm ping
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Loqi kylewm: tantek left you a message 3 hours, 15 minutes ago: captured a bunch about displaying likes on posts, why/how to, examples - would appreciate your feedback/iterations and additional IndieWeb Example entries! https://indiewebcamp.com/likes#How_to http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-06-18/line/1434662183645
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Loqi pong
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tantek welcome back kylewm :)
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kylewm tantek: I think this is handwaving over an important bit https://indiewebcamp.com/likes#you%20know%20you%20can%20count%20that%20like%20of%20the%20POSSE%20copy%20as%20a%20duplicate
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kylewm specifically, you know that the like coming from tantek.com will have a POSSE copy, but not WHICH POSSE copy it is
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kylewm I mean while we're at it, I also don't think originals should u-like-of originals *and* their POSSE copies
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tantek yeah I was both experimenting and using that to use Bridgy Publish to POSSE the like/fave to Twitter
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tantek figured it might make it easier for de-duping
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kylewm fyi Bridgy Publish will follow the u-syndication links in the target to find its twitter URL
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kylewm little less work for you :)
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tantek really?!?
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kylewm well, it's implemented... if it doesn't work it's a bug not a feature request ;)
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aaronpk whoa
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aaronpk bridgy++
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Loqi bridgy has 14 karma
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aaronpk bridgy++ needs more karma
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tantek I don't think the same person can karma +2 in such short order
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tantek bridgy++ :)
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Loqi bridgy has 15 karma
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aaronpk loqi++
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Loqi loqi has 353 karma
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bear bridgy++
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Loqi bridgy has 16 karma
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KartikPrabhu bridgy++ ;)
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Loqi too much karma!
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aaronpk Loqi: sometimes it is not enough karma
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Loqi :)
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KartikPrabhu Loqi: bridgy wants more karma
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aaronpk !give karma to bridgy
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Loqi gives to bridgy to karma
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aaronpk oops
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KartikPrabhu lol
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aaronpk !give bridgy karma
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kylewm thinks Loqi is jealous of bridgy
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Loqi gives karma to bridgy
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KartikPrabhu who me? ;) sorry aaronpk
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bear bridgy++
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kylewm.com created /RedMatrix (+206) "Created page with "{{stub}} <dfn>[https://redmatrix.me RedMatrix]</dfn> (sometimes The Red Matrix, Redmatrix, or redmatrix) is a decentralized publishing and identity platform, from the same peopl..."" (view diff)
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kylewm.com created /redmatrix (+23) "Redirected page to [[RedMatrix]]" (view diff)
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kylewm.com created /Red_Matrix (+23) "Redirected page to [[RedMatrix]]" (view diff)
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acegiak morning, all
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aaronpk evening!
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acegiak KevinMarks: Play is the only available word for games so in the context of scrobbles it makes sense to use it as the term for games when other words are better for other media
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acegiak all interactions with games are plays but not all listens of songs are plays and not all watching of films etc are plays
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KevinMarks_ this is bizarre http://googleresearch.blogspot.com/2015/06/inceptionism-going-deeper-into-neural.html
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aaronpk love it
KartikPrabhu, wolftune, benwerd, endi, snarfed, tilgovi, gRegorLove, KevinMarks__, KevinMarks, rbrt, tantek, snarfed1, KevinMarks_, frzn, cweiske, scoates, nt0, davemenninger, eschnou, lukebrooker, chalettu, friedcell, poka, Guerillero|BNC, Zegnat, elf-pavlik, Pierre-O, Sebastien-L, loic_m, yalamerde, evalica, tvn, stream7, sanduhrs and Garbee joined the channel
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@mapkyca Doing server upgrades, so finally pulled my finger out and moved my blog over to https only with HSTS and a 301 redirect. #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/611846835301449728)
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rhiaro.co.uk edited /pin (+381) "/* Brainstorming */" (view diff)
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rhiaro what is pin
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Loqi pin or pinning is a feature that allows the author to choose a post to put at the top of their profile (or homepage) which is then called a pinned or sticky post https://indiewebcamp.com/pin
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rhiaro !tell aaronpk, kylewm How do readers sort/order posts? Do they keep them in the order they find them in a feed, or sort them themselves by published date? (ie. If I have a pinned post, I don't want it to be pinned for people consuming my feed via a reader, only for people viewing my site. I'm guessing readers sort posts themselves by pubdate so would insert a pinned post chronologically as normal)
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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cweiske rhiaro, how do you mark up pinned posts?
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rhiaro cweiske: I dunno yet. Nobody has it so far. I'm thinking about playing with it soonish
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Zegnat Does WordPress add some specific classes to their “sticky posts”? That might be something to build it off
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GWG Zegnat: WordPress adds classes for a lot of things
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Zegnat I realise that GWG, but if we have to find a way to communicate a pinned post on the indieweb why not look at what WordPress does first
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acegiak rhiaro: my reader sorts by either the published date listed or the date the post was first discovered
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acegiak in that order
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GWG Zegnat: Agreed
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GWG acegiak: Have you looked at the latest comment changes in mf2_s?
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GWG On an unrelated note
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acegiak GWG: not yet, I'll look now
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GWG I can show you a test page
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acegiak GWG: yeah do
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GWG https://tiny.n9n.us/2014/10/23/farewell-dublin/
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GWG It's a reproduction of an actual page from my live site.
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acegiak GWG: looks all good to me
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GWG Need to refine it a bit more, but I think I got the 'simple' presentation that fits with the _s minimalism I am trying for.
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acegiak GWG: also, I'm trying to work out how to make sure that salmention comments don't duplicate when update mentions come through multiple times. Do you know how semantic linkbacks stores the permalink?
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GWG semantic_linkbacks_canonical - the canonical source url
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rhiaro.co.uk edited /User:Rhiaro.co.uk (+1868) "Update itches and doing/done" (view diff)
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rhiaro thanks acegiak
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rhiaro that seems like the most sensible way to do it
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acegiak that's what I thought
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acegiak but at the same time a couple of people have posted items with FUTURE published dates which have effectively pinned them to the top of my reader until that time
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cweiske like spam mails
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david.shanske.com edited /User:David.shanske.com (+125) "/* Wordpress Development */" (view diff)
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rhiaro.co.uk edited /User:Rhiaro.co.uk (+103) "/* Slog'd */" (view diff)
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rhiaro acegiak: yeah I've done that in the past and they've stuck to the top of woodwind which is really annoying so I stopped that at once
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rhiaro For a while I was doing travel plans and events only based on the date of the thing, rather than the published date of the post. I fixed it so they have separate published dates now.
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rhiaro Which is more useful, because I do want to post *when I make a plan* as well as when the plan/event will be carried out
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rhiaro And I have special feeds, /travel and /calendar, which actually sort by the event date rather than the published date
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rhiaro So if people *want* my calendar stuck to the top of their reader they still have that option by subscribing to /travel or /calendar instead..
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david.shanske.com edited /User:David.shanske.com (-16) "/* Itches */" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme good morning #indiewebcamp
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LanceyWork good morning ben_thatmustbeme
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ben_thatmustbeme quite morning
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ben_thatmustbeme s/quite/quiet/
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Loqi ben_thatmustbeme meant to say: quiet morning
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LanceyWork people were talking a while ago
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LanceyWork maybe everyone's busy suddenly
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ben_thatmustbeme yeah, but that was pretty minor too
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ben_thatmustbeme fridays usually tend to be slow around here though i guess
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kylewm rhiaro: woodwind uses published dates the first time it polls a feed ... to backfill old posts. for new posts from then on, it uses the received date. so if there was a future-dated post in the first pull, i guess it would be stuck to the top of the feed :/ I should fix that
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Loqi kylewm: rhiaro left you a message 4 hours, 21 minutes ago: How do readers sort/order posts? Do they keep them in the order they find them in a feed, or sort them themselves by published date? (ie. If I have a pinned post, I don't want it to be pinned for people consuming my feed via a reader, only for people viewing my site. I'm guessing readers sort posts themselves by pubdate so would insert a pinned post chronologically as normal) http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-06-19/line/1434711935195
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@itwars “@nledez: If you want install @MyCozyCloud in one command (as root): https://t.co/2SLf1bUJ4Q” #ownyourdata #privacy #cloud #FrenchTech (twitter.com/_/status/611928384059392000)
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@jeanfrancis RT @itwars: “@nledez: If you want install @MyCozyCloud in one command (as root): https://t.co/2SLf1bUJ4Q” #ownyourdata #privacy #cloud #Fre… (twitter.com/_/status/611928629598142464)
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gRegorLove Morning, indiewebcamp
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Loqi gRegorLove: tantek left you a message on 6/18 at 5:29pm: when you have a few moments, could you create the HWC event pages for 2015-07-01, -15, -29 ? Thanks! http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-06-18/line/1434673768132
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gregorlove.com created /events/2015-07-01-homebrew-website-club (+4527) "hwc" (view diff)
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aaronpk gRegorLove: what are you copying that from?
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gregorlove.com created /events/2015-07-15-homebrew-website-club (+4527) "hwc" (view diff)
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Loqi aaronpk: rhiaro left you a message 5 hours, 35 minutes ago: How do readers sort/order posts? Do they keep them in the order they find them in a feed, or sort them themselves by published date? (ie. If I have a pinned post, I don't want it to be pinned for people consuming my feed via a reader, only for people viewing my site. I'm guessing readers sort posts themselves by pubdate so would insert a pinned post chronologically as normal) http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-06-19/line/1434711935195
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aaronpk it has really old portland info
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gRegorLove The original version of hwc 6/17, the last one in the list.
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aaronpk oh interesting
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gRegorLove I don't see it. Is it commented out?
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aaronpk yeah it's commented out and has the "cancelled tonight" and <s> in it
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gRegorLove If you update 7/1 I'll fix it on the 15th and 29th
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aaronpk and every time I have to change that
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aaronpk i'll update the 7/1 one
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gRegorLove Oops. Probably my fault. At a certain point I started using the initial revision and just updating dates so it's easy to copy/paste without cutting out RSVPs, etc.
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aaronpk ah yeah. i'm just not sure how to break this cycle then
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gRegorLove Hah, it has Minneapolis too. very old.
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gRegorLove I don't think the recent events are using the same base revision I was.
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gRegorLove I'll just make a mental note to use the 7/1 + version.
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aaronpk i'm going to add the hack night stuff that I put on 6/3 too
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aaronpk i think quiet writing hour might not be {{new}} anymore too :)
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aaronparecki.com edited /events/2015-07-01-homebrew-website-club (+111) "attempt to create a new base event to copy from" (view diff)
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aaronpk k try that
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gregorlove.com edited /events/2015-07-01-homebrew-website-club (-409) "/* Where */ rm Minneapolis" (view diff)
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gregorlove.com edited /events/2015-07-15-homebrew-website-club (-298) "fix" (view diff)
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gregorlove.com created /events/2015-07-29-homebrew-website-club (+4229) "hwc" (view diff)
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gregorlove.com edited /events/2015-06-17-homebrew-website-club (+0) "fix u-url, log link" (view diff)
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@nledez RT @itwars: “@nledez: If you want install @MyCozyCloud in one command (as root): https://t.co/2SLf1bUJ4Q” #ownyourdata #privacy #cloud #Fre… (twitter.com/_/status/611945850420523008)
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aaronpk gRegorLove++
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Loqi gRegorLove has 12 karma
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tantek gRegorLove++ thanks much! Also, Chicago is no more either right? And NYC is once a month?
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Loqi gRegorLove has 13 karma
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gRegorLove still holds out hope for Chicago restarting. ;)
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gRegorLove I don't know on NYC. I'm out of the HWC loop :)
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tantek GWG, how often do you like to organize HWC NYC? I vaguely remember once a month?
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tantek also - 3 weeks til IWC 2015!!!
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gRegorLove Woo!
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GWG I haven't spoken to zachdonovan in a while. We're trying for once a month, but both he and I were booked this month
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GWG June 3rd I was on a plane, June 17th he was occupied.
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aaronpk I got in touch with the place I want to do the pre-party at yesterday
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tantek sweet!
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gRegorLove I have no idea what I will work on at IWC, but I think I'm on schedule to have my site moved over to ProcessWire framework, including webmention+vouch support. Pretty excited about that.
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aaronpk they're getting all grown up now, no more ad-hoc show up with a big group and do drink tickets :)
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tantek GWG, also - if an in-between Wednesday works better than any of the "on" Wednesdays, do it then.
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tantek better to have at least one HWC NYC a month than none at all because the "on" Wednesdays didn't work out!
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tantek hmm maybe I should add that to the doc
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aaronpk so i'm gonna have to reserve the back room, which means a drink minimum slightly larger than our previous tabs, so I hope we get more people to show up to the preparty!
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gRegorLove IWC pre-party on Friday evening?
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aaronpk yep!
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tantek aaronpk: can we do some of that minimum with sponsored drink tickets?
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ben_thatmustbeme for some reason i remember there being an indieauth logo SVG
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ben_thatmustbeme cannot seem to find it
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aaronpk tantek: yeah i'm planning on paying the whole bill from the sponsorship, i just hope people drink a lot :)
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tantek got it
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tantek NYC is way more than up & coming
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GWG We've moved on to hopelessly optimistic?
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@AlexKKearney First syndication test tweet! #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/611957105965277184)
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gregorlove.com edited /2015 (-9) "/* Schedule */ link to existing schedule page" (view diff)
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gregorlove.com edited /2015 (+9) "/* Schedule */ oops, link text. preview your edits, g" (view diff)
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tantek !tell KartikPrabhu are you still interested in restarting Chicago HWC meetups if you're able to find a co-organizer?
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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aaronpk i'm really struggling with this "no explicit post types" thing
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tantek aaronpk: perhaps you are approaching it from the plumbing instead of the UX?
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aaronpk well I am doing the plumbing now
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aaronpk there are some different kinds of posts that need to have different HTML output, so where can I put the templates if not in a post type?
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tantek how did your sketching exercises go for the new UI/UX?
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aaronpk it's mostly lists of things right now, maybe I do need some explicit sketches
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tantek are these posts generated by your site UX, or by some other method? (e.g. via OwnYourGram, PESOS from quantified self silos, etc.)
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tantek yeah - definitely need explicit sketches
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tantek start at home. what if any UI do you have on your home page? for creating a new post on your home page? (e.g. like Twitter, FB, etc.)
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aaronpk I printed out all the differnt kinds of posts I have and want http://aaron.pk/n4bc1
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aaronpk i'm trying to find what they have in common to avoid needing to make separate post type classes/templates for each
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tantek that's good that you have a list of "exits" as it were, however, I still think you should start with designing from the *entrance* of your flow. Your home page, at the top, either *just* a "new post" button, or *one text box* with a "Post" button below it.
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tantek and then try to figure out what it is you need to add to that, why and when (e.g. conditionally based on what you might type into the box)
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aaronpk i don't really want to do anything with my posting interface right now
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aaronpk that's a whole different story. i'm going to stick to posting from quill for now.
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tantek.com edited /Homebrew_Website_Club (+325) "/* Meetings */ Move NYC from up&coming to Regular Meetings, move Savannah to Up-and-coming, past meetings call to action" (view diff)
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aaronpk right now i'm just trying to figure out how to render new HTML for all of my posts
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tantek here's my premise, that without understanding the full flow from UX -> post output, you won't know how much explicit markup you need when for different kinds of posting behavior
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aaronpk hmm, but I'm not changing any of the input. I'm still using Quill, Monocle, Teacup, Ownyourgram, and other automatic import scripts to create posts
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tantek does p3k use micropub to post to p3k?
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aaronpk it doesn't right now, but if I build a posting interface into the new one it likely will
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aaronpk i would much rather have only one way posts are created: the micropub endpoint
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tantek sure, yet the design of that endpoint should be driven by what UX works the best.
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aaronpk right, but i am also not writing the micropub endpoint right now. right now I have a pile of source files of these posts, and I need to turn them into sensible HTML
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tantek I vaguely remember rhiaro doing some analysis about how type-less primary posts make general sense, and yet *responses* may in practice be explicitly typed from the start, since they typically each have their own explicit UI
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tantek kind of wondering if that got captured somewhere. rhiaro?
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aaronpk i think ideally i would have a generic post template, and have things added to it depending on what's in the post. e.g. if there's a photo, show an <img> tag. if there's a route, show the map.
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tantek I like adactio's approach
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rhiaro aaronpk that's what I do more it less
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tantek I also like the idea of a generic post template with parameterized additions like that as a starting point.
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aaronpk i think it is a good starting point, but pretty sure there are some of these that won't fit that model, so i'll have to break them out
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aaronpk and that's when I get dangerously close to "typed posts" territory
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rhiaro I actually only have one template for an individual post
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tantek I disagree with that leap to typed posts
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rhiaro And a few different templates for lists
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tantek the limitation of the one generic template is in the UX of the result - all the posts start looking the same
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rhiaro Though probably a bit too much logic in my templates
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tantek the motivation for making different templates should not come from a notion of abstract types, but rather, to provide a richer UX for what you're posting
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tantek that's why you have to start with sketching that richer UX if you really want something like that
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ben_thatmustbeme http://indieid.com/
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ben_thatmustbeme thoughts on the logo
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ben_thatmustbeme waiting for my SSL certificate now
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ben_thatmustbeme finally picked a name
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tantek that wasn't taken?!?
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ben_thatmustbeme amazingly
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tantek um, the logo looks kinda ominous? like it's telling the reader to "Die"?!?
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ben_thatmustbeme yes
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ben_thatmustbeme lol
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ben_thatmustbeme i just did that quick, i'm not a designer, but good point
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tantek whendevelopersmakelogos.tumblr.com
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tantek ;)
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ben_thatmustbeme i actually just checked that thinking it was a thing
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ben_thatmustbeme it should be
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aaronpk checks who else currently posts reposts
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tantek wonders if he should implement that next just to mix things up ;)
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aaronpk it appears nobody else actualyl includes the text/author name/author photo of the thing being reposted?
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rhiaro I should also add all my posts do basically look the same and I haven't done as much as I can to invite ux yet
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aaronpk i see a lot of reposts that are just URLs
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rhiaro aaronpk that's next on my list
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Loqi definitely
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rhiaro I finally made all my itches (and bugs) issues on bitbucket today!
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aaronpk nice
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aaronpk is it public?
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rhiaro Yeah
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rhiaro bitbucket.org/rhiaro/slogd
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tantek aaronpk - well I think some of us sketched how reposts should look (and markup implied therein) in NYC last year
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tantek that *did* include the text/author name/author photo of the thing being reposted
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rhiaro I had author name and photo briefly before I changed everything
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aaronpk yeah i would expect a repost to look like your own post but with a different author, like how twitter does it
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tantek aaronpk - I do know that we've seen indieweb iterations of reposts that didn't look like reposts
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rhiaro I feel like I want it to be in a blockquote
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rhiaro My posts don't have my face twitter style anyway
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tantek rhiaro: have you seen the repost sketches?
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tantek what is repost design?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "repost design" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=repost+design&summary=prompted+by+tantek+https%3A%2F%2Findiewebcamp.com%2Firc%2F2015-06-19%2Fline%2F1434739517901
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rhiaro Possibly, link! (On my phone, don't have energy for search..)
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rhiaro s/!/?
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Loqi rhiaro meant to say: Possibly, link? (On my phone, don't have energy for search..)
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tantek.com created /repost_design (+41) "redirect until others come up with better ideas and we iterate on this page itself" (view diff)
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aaronpk I am actually pretty happy with how my reposts look right now
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tantek aaronpk - except your faves look like reposts
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aaronpk hey I didn't say the same about my favorites ;)
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aaronpk probably gonna change that
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tantek aaronpk: the contamination is real. if/when people see your faves first, then they may not notice your reposts because they look like faves
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rhiaro I'm torn about expanding likes similarly to reposta
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tantek rhiaro: why? have you looked at how silos display them differently?
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tantek e.g. likes vs. shares ?
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kylewm aaronpk: what makes you say "nobody else actualyl includes the text/author name/author photo of the thing being reposted"?
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aaronpk kylewm: i just clicked through the examples on /repost
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kylewm you missed at least one of them then :P
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aaronpk ah yes i did in fact miss yours
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rhiaro People aren't going to click things, so no one would actually see what I like. Maybe it doesn't matter cos it's for the benefit of the original author, but I'm not sure
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rhiaro Based on I never click on links of what people have liked, but always feel like I'm missing out seeing what it was
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tantek rhiaro: you didn't answer my question.
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kylewm aaronpk: I'm trying out different markup than I was using before... now the top-level h-entry looks like it's by the author of the reposted thing
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rhiaro I answered 'why'
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kylewm previously I had u-repost-of h-cite inside the e-content of the h-entry
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rhiaro I can only type so fast on my phone..
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aaronpk fwiw twitter shows favorites the same as reposts https://twitter.com/aaronpk/favorites
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rhiaro Facebook and twitter don't treat likes as first class posts, do they?
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tantek no that's a special favorites-only display
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aaronpk that's the only place they show up
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tantek aaronpk: disagreed - you cannot deduce faves=retweets from that URL
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aaronpk my twitter profile does not show favorites
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tantek aaronpk: no they also who show up in your "notifications"
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aaronpk https://twitter.com/aaronpk <- no favorites there
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tantek s/who show/show
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aaronpk i'm not designing my notifications page right now
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Loqi tantek meant to say: aaronpk: no they also show up in your "notifications"
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tantek aaronpk: the point is that they show up differently when in a composite list
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aaronpk but the notifications list is targeted at *me*
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aaronpk whereas my home page is not
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aaronpk also the things I favorite do not show up in my notifications list
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aaronpk notifications of people favoriting my posts != me publishing a list of things I favorited
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rhiaro They look the same in Android Twitter notifications
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rhiaro Getting screenshot
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aaronpk actually now that i think about it, my site is doing the same thing twitter does with reposts and likes.
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aaronpk things I like don't show up on my home page at all, and when you go to http://aaronparecki.com/likes you see the things I've liked, just like https://twitter.com/aaronpk/favorites
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rhiaro Basically the same with different icons
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rhiaro http://rhiaro.co.uk/stash/twitandnotif150619.png
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tantek.com edited /LiteSpeed (+419) "Issues, htaccess AddType text html causes text plain" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /LiteSpeed (+127) "/* htaccess AddType text html causes text plain */ actually DefaultType is the problem" (view diff)
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tantek aaronpk - do your Twitter faves show images inline or not?
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tantek I don't think it's actually doing the *exact* same thing
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tantek I think likes tend to show more "summary"-like information of the thing being liked. Short amount of text or title. Smaller thumbnail of the image. etc.
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aaronpk both show the images inline
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tantek Whereas reposts show *the whole thing*, as that's the intent of doing a repost!
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tantek anyway I have a pretty different opinion of like presentation anyway, as I've documented on /like#Brainstorming
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tantek including all the collapsing stuff
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aaronpk twitter: http://aaronparecki.com/uploads/twitter-likes-20150619-120615.png my site: http://aaronparecki.com/uploads/my-site-20150619-120631.png
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aaronpk yeah for my *home page* I don't want the same rendering of likes that I currently have
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aaronpk but twitter doesn't even put the things you've liked into a composite stream of things you've tweeted or RT'd
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tantek too narrow thinking
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tantek they have a *general* design for composite stream of faves and rts - and they use that design in the specific instance of notifications
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tantek it doesn't mean it's limited to only notifications
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tantek in its applicability
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aaronpk but they literally don't have anywhere else where the things i've liked are displayed
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tantek the "you've liked" vs. "others haved liked" is an orthogonal aspect
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tantek and by focusing on that you're missing the point of their design
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aaronpk i think notification design is a completely different thing
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tantek not in a static web view like that
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tantek only in "alert" style
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tantek which used to mean "notification" til the word got diluted to mean things that *you check* and aren't actually *notifying* you
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KartikPrabhu loqi message?
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Loqi KartikPrabhu: tantek left you a message 1 hour, 8 minutes ago: are you still interested in restarting Chicago HWC meetups if you're able to find a co-organizer? http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-06-19/line/1434737170438
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Loqi woot!
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KartikPrabhu tantek: yes definitely! Gives me a reason to go back to working on the site
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tantek KartikPrabhu: cool! maybe update /HWC accordingly then? make it explicit that you're looking for another co-organizer! :)
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KartikPrabhu aah sure thing! good idea
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aaronparecki.com edited /2015/Schedule (-80) "pre-party venue confirmed!" (view diff)
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tantek aaronpk++ woot!
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Loqi aaronpk has 858 karma
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aaronpk and we won't have a drink minimum since we won't be exclusively renting out the space
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@diplix #indieweb so i just non-visibly responded to the @medium response anouncement article & copied it to my server, too. http://wirres.net/article/articleview/7884/1/6/ (twitter.com/_/status/611981885846237184)
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tantek rhiaro: re: http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-06-19/line/1434713754327 that's an interesting approach. As I keep off-and-on working on /event posts for Falcon, I keep coming back to having both the event itself, which is an h-event, and comments / (activity?) on that event, such as the first comment "created the event" (based on FB UI)
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tantek rhiaro: that way that first "comment" would show up in my main home page stream, as all my replies do
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tantek even if the event was nowhere to be found because all it has is a dt-start in the future
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Kongaloosh rhiaro: I figured out syndication!
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Kongaloosh I get everything from my instagram, and can tweet.C:
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tantek rhiaro I'm pretty sure that having such a separate "event" and "comment that says created the event" posts solves the problem you were running into.
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KartikPrabhu Kongaloosh++
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Loqi Kongaloosh has 1 karma
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Kongaloosh KartikPrabhu: danke
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rhiaro Tantek, sounds like activities!
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aaronpk i wasn't going to say it
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aaronpk :P
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tantek rhiaro: I was thinking that too, except even in FB, that "create the event" comment 1) has a permalink, 2) can be liked, 3) can be commented upon. So it sounds more like a full fledged post to me - again, no need to make up a new term "activity" in practice.
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rhiaro So activities is just two posts instead of one
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tantek I'm pretty convinced that the only people who think "activity" is necessary as a concept are not actually building this stuff for the open web and using it.
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rhiaro An activity can have a permalink etc just a redundant name
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rhiaro I don't want two posts for all my travel plans
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tantek still doesn't justify the existence of the term
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tantek I haven't gotten to travel plans yet
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tantek I would have to go back in time to see how Dopplr did it.
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rhiaro My main problem with 'activities' is the duplication
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tantek my main problem is the use of the term
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gRegorLove Just noticed a "Ask for [name]'s name pronunciation" on a Facebook friend's about page. Interesting.
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tantek I think there's a vCard property for that ;)
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gRegorLove Also interesting data collection technique on their part. Get people to get their friends to give FB data :)
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tantek oh they've had the "Ask for [name]'s {{propertyname}}" prompts for a while
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tantek phone number, city etc.
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@BikelandiaNet @aaronpk Do you have a large banner for IndieWebCamp made of paper or other physical materials? we have a publicity stunt idea ... (twitter.com/_/status/611989521941401600)
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aaronpk oh my
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tantek lol
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gRegorLove Yeah, I've seen the prompts, just hadn't thought about it in these terms before
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aaronpk man i'm spinning in circles here
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aaronpk can't decide what i want my posts to look like lol
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aaronpk many tiny decisions need to be made
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@diplix RT @kevinmarks: #indieweb @kevinmarks: #indieweb @kevinmarks: you can curl http://t.co/3OIKAizGBX] to archive a post (twitter.com/_/status/611991757610287104)
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tantek It's good that you're focusing on post presentation, as that's the hardest and most important thing to get right, that then drives the other things.
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aaronpk also realizing there is a big difference in how i want the posts to look when in a list vs on their permalink pages
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tantek yup
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Loqi gives aaronpk the posts to look when in a list vs on their permalink pages
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tantek and potentially in a composite stream vs. uniform stream
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tantek and potentially in "most recent" (e.g. home) stream vs. archive page
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aaronpk yeah, hadn't really considered different presentation for that but maybe that would solve some of this..
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aaronpk i'm definitely treating my home page as a special case though
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tantek because each have different purposes
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tantek KevinMarks: is this a noterlive error? the duplicate tag and @-name? https://twitter.com/kevinmarks/status/611348938562646017
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@kevinmarks #indieweb @kevinmarks: #indieweb @kevinmarks: you can curl http://t.co/3OIKAizGBX] to archive a post (twitter.com/_/status/611348938562646017)
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gRegorLove That's quite a reply-context https://kylewm.com/2015/06/yay-that-bird-looks-like-it-s-doing-much-better-is kylewm, acegiak
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gRegorLove I like the updated layout, kylewm
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kylewm gRegorLove: implicit p-name strikes again
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tantek kylewm: is this not related to that already solved parsing issue?
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GWG I've been working on parts of it, as I'm partly responsible.
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kylewm tantek: which issue do you have in mind? this one is slightly tricky to detect since the e-content is just an <img> tag -- there's no way to detect that the content is contained within the name
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tantek kylewm: was thinking the backcompat stuff not causing p-name
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tantek not causing implied p-name in particular
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Loqi [mention] gRegor Morrill commented 'Implicit p-name is my rap name. #indieweb' on a post http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-06-19/line/1434746925446 (/notes/2015/06/19/3/)
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kylewm tantek: I dont think so because it's not backcompat
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gRegorLove Heh, Bridgy edge case. Can't auto-publish to Twitter when the in-reply-to is a non-Twitter URL (IWC chat log link)
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tantek why?
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gRegorLove "Could not find a tweet to reply to. Check that your post has an in-reply-to link a Twitter URL or to an original post that publishes a rel-syndication link to Twitter."
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tantek my POSSE code auto-publishes to Twitter for non-tweet replies
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tantek weird
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gRegorLove Not a complaint really. Kinda makes sense.
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@gRegorLove Implicit p-name is my rap name. #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/612002028697489409)
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tantek hmm - I don't think so - for such replies I still @-them but then start with re: in-reply-to-URL
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gRegorLove Are you using Bridgy Publish or something else to POSSE?
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gRegorLove I'm not @-ing anyone
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aaronpk hmm i'm curious if other peoples' internal storage stores the raw authored text, or escaped HTML
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tantek gRegorLove: my own code. I'm talking about conceptually.
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gRegorLove Maybe I used in-reply-to incorrectly
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tantek aaronpk since my storage files are HTML, the answer is escaped HTML
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aaronpk e.g. when displaying a note that contains <> is it stored interally as "<>" or "&lt;&gt;"?
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tantek or rather, HTML-escaped raw authored text
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aaronpk tantek: so everything in your storage is okay to output to the browser without further escaping?
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tantek yeah I have to explicitly type &amp; into my storage
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tantek correct
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tantek that was the most expedient in terms of balancing concerns
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tantek I'm not saying it's ideal
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aaronpk that seems reasonable. I just realized I have to change how I handle it in order to drop post types
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aaronpk right now my articles are markdown (with optional html of course), but everything else cannot have HTML in the content, so every other post type goes through an escaping process
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tantek right now my notes are HTML-escaped plain text, and my articles are HTML with explicit markup
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tantek does that help?
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kylewm gRegorLove: tantek: penny for your thoughts on publishing replies to twitter that aren't replies to tweets
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tantek auto_link is only run on note content
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tantek kylewm I believe I wrote them up but let me check...
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gRegorLove aaronpk: My notes are stored in HTML in the database.
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gRegorLove I do not auto_link yet, so I'm writing HTML links.
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kylewm we've also had requests to POSSE likes that aren't like-of a tweet
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kylewm gRegorLove: here's the issue, from ben_thatmustbeme https://github.com/snarfed/bridgy/issues/362
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gRegorLove I don't have many thoughts on it since this is my first time running into it. Seems like nice-to-have but not a high priority.
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gRegorLove Esp. given what snarfed raised in that issue
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tantek I've totally done this - POSSED to Twitter my replies to non-tweets
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tantek in a sensible way
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kylewm http://indiewebcamp.com/Twitter#POSSE_Replies_to_Twitter
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Loqi [bridgy] Pierre replied '@GetEventsCo do you parse the web to look for microformat? For instance here: tokoloho.co' to a tweet http://indiewebcamp.com/ (https://twitter.com/pierreozoux/status/611116689305026560)
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tantek kylewm: huh interesting - looks like I haven't updated that section since my first thoughts on the topic!
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kylewm here's a reply to a non-tweet that is possed to twitter http://tantek.com/2015/159/t2/of-the-indieweb-because-silos-die
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tantek hmm - adactio's h-entry parsing is still quite broken
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tantek https://adactio.com/journal/9016#comment19204 - comment permalink is wrong, date is wrong
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tantek kylewm: so there are two variants apparently that I'm using
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tantek when I post a reply to an indieweb post
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tantek that has no obvious POSSE tweet copy
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tantek variant one: my reply works as a standalone statement, with in-reply-to post as reference material for more context. e.g. the example you gave: http://tantek.com/2015/159/t2/of-the-indieweb-because-silos-die
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tantek variant two: my reply only really makes sense in the context of the original, and thus I look up the @-name of the indieweb post author, use it to start my reply, followed by re: ((in-reply--to permashortlink)) e.g. http://tantek.com/2015/162/t3/reply-three-deep and http://tantek.com/2015/162/t2/indieweb-ui-ux-sketch-build
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tantek the reason is, that way the only people that see those POSSE tweet replies are people that follow both me and the author of the original indieweb post, and thus have a decent chance of having seen their indieweb post in some other form
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@kylewmahan RT @gRegorLove: Implicit p-name is my rap name. #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/612013516103401472)
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kylewm totally makes sense and makes it tricky to pick any one way with bridgy publish.
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tantek kylewm: the safe (forgiving, less noisy) thing would be to pick variant 2 for bridgy publish
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tantek as most replies written by people only really makes sense in the context of the original
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tantek and if people know they can depend on that behavior (with the scoping @-name in front) they may be more comfortable just using it, knowing that they're not spamming everyone
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KevinMarks tantek: re http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-06-19/line/1434745308996 no it's a sloppy copy paste error on my part when fixing the link
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KevinMarks also the [url] bit makes it a bad link nayway
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KevinMarks see http://www.kevinmarks.com/hwc2015-06-17.html
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KevinMarks implicit p-name messes up my indiecard too
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tantek oh looks like you duplicated that whole entry
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KevinMarks yep
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KevinMarks I shoudl edit it
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KevinMarks I pasted the rendered text back in and edited it, so it got 2 cites