#indieweb 2017-07-16

2017-07-16 UTC
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[miklb] ooh. ScalaWilliam silo.pub has support for creating GH issues, might be able to use micropub to create an issue while creating the entry https://silo.pub/developers#vocab-github
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TheGillies irc template should input an id on a tag so people can #link-to-id in url for rel=me
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TheGillies e.g. https://indieweb.org/IRC_People#TheGillies
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aaronpk good idea
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aaronpk TheGillies++ https://indieweb.org/irc-people#TheGillies
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Loqi thegillies has 4 karma in this channel (35 overall)
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aaronpk and XRay can parse that too https://xray.p3k.io/parse?url=https%3A%2F%2Findieweb.org%2Firc-people%23TheGillies
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tantek Does anyone here have a "donate" or "donations" link / page on their site? (in UI and functionality - different from just having a /pay or /payment page)
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aaronpk I have a "tip jar" link on one article https://aaronparecki.com/oauth-2-simplified/
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Loqi [Aaron Parecki] OAuth 2 Simplified
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aaronpk It links to https://aaronparecki.com/tip/ which is different from my payment page
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Loqi [Aaron Parecki] Tip Jar
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gRegorLove Dang, photobucket: http://www.denverpost.com/2017/07/06/photobucket-complaints-over-charging/
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[jeremycherfas] I don't suppose it is possible to get a feed of the people I follow on Instagram without the adverts and in chronological order?
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prtksxna [jeremycherfas]: I think granary will give you all the data you need
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[jeremycherfas] Thanks. I'll look into that.
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TheGillies Have you guys thought of creating indieweb in a box that provides all the backend indieweb services. Then people can be free to create whatever front end they want?
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TheGillies And still be indie compliant
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KartikPrabhu TheGillies: there are many "backends" that do that for example Known
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KartikPrabhu or Wordpress withplugins
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TheGillies Ah. Yeah good point I guess I could just link to known for webmentions etc
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TheGillies I'm more talking about static sites
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TheGillies Since that's what I usually build
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TheGillies They don't have ability for webhooks and such
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[miklb] The IndieWeb WordPress plugin has an installer to add the necessary plugins, there is discussion on how to improve that experience
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TheGillies That's awesomeness for the people who use WordPress
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[miklb] ongoing discussions
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TheGillies Which I hope never to be :p
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KartikPrabhu TheGillies: there are indieweb compatible things for static sites too.
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TheGillies What do you mean? Like known? Or other projects?
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KartikPrabhu what is static?
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Loqi A static site is a website that is served by a web server directly from the file system https://indieweb.org/static
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TheGillies Thnx
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KartikPrabhu what is jekyll
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Loqi Jekyll is Ruby software that helps you create "Simple, blog-aware, static sites" suitable for static domain hosting https://indieweb.org/Jekyll
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KartikPrabhu I am sure there are more
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[miklb] what is hugo
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Loqi Hugo is a static site generator written in Go https://indieweb.org/hugo
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[chrisaldrich] jeremycherfas I think that https://instagram-atom.appspot.com might also output this kind of feed for you.
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TheGillies woah https://webmention.herokuapp.com/ is sexay
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TheGillies i haz webmentions https://kodo.keybase.pub/webmention.html
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sl007 hello, world
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sl007 security issue: Shouldn't the W3C demand `https` from any official WHOIS service ? E.g. http://whois.nic.me has NO https …
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sl007 Or the IANA or whoever is responsible ..
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Zegnat sl007 aren't whois records basically public knowledge? Does public knowledge require an encryption layer?
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Zegnat Also: good morning IndieWeb!
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sl007 Zegnat : The problem here is that when a domain request would be submitted and somebody sniffs it, they know about our desire for a domain and could park it.
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sl007 it is not about content but about request
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sl007 Zegnat : Not sure about the english term - "domain snatching" ?
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Zegnat Sure. But you could just use something like command line nslookup, right?
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Zegnat If nslookup gives you NXDOMAIN the domain is probably free, good enough cursory check. And this goes via your DNS provider, which you already seem to trust as you are using them to tell you what server goes with what domain.
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Zegnat brb, breakfast
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jeremycherfas Good morning Indieweb
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sl007 Zegnat But both can be entirely different. Whois finds the owner of the IP addresses (ARIN). Nslookup
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sl007 queries DNS for the associated domain name. And there should be a possibility (not must) to query both secure.
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jeremycherfas Re https://chat.indieweb.org/2017-07-16/1500184521716000 — all done.
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Loqi [[chrisaldrich]] jeremycherfas I think that https://instagram-atom.appspot.com might also output this kind of feed for you.
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jeremycherfas https://www.jeremycherfas.net/blog/set-my-photos-free
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Loqi Set my photos free
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jeremycherfas Snarfed++
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Loqi snarfed has 278 karma in this channel (290 overall)
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Zegnat sl007, but if you are afraid of squatters grabbing the domain before you, all you are interested in is if a domain is free. nslookup is *almost* as good at checking that as whois. Though I agree whois over HTPS would be nice.
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Zegnat jeremycherfas nice! Follow all the people where you want to follow them :D
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sketchess Good morning Loqi.
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sketchess Good morning Indieweb.
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jeremycherfas Zegnat: I suppose Woodwind would let me like direct from the feed, but that’s too much for me now.
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sketchess I found your 'appear' link and tried the other service with my browser, Zegnat. Compared to jitsy it is not my first choice for HWC. Firefox and jitsi go better together.
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Zegnat sketchess how so? I use Firefox exclusively for WebRTC stuff and appear.in works as easily for me as jitsi meet does
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Zegnat jeremycherfas, sometimes consuming is the main goal by itself. I definitely consume a lot more media than I actively interact with
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jeremycherfas Zegnat: Oh, for sure. In IG I definitely look at far more photos than I like, and I like far more than I comment on. So that friction really isn’t an issue.
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sketchess I do not know why it restarts as soon as I touch something. I can not really use it, not even mute or unmute, Zegnat. And even if I gave permission to microphone and camera it acts odd.
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Zegnat Can you try in an anonymous browser window, sketchess?
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sketchess Please explain a bit further, I am not sure if I am on the right track of understanding.
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sketchess What do you mean by 'anonymous'?
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sketchess gives it another shot
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sketchess -.- at least it lets me mute the microphone this time without througing me out. Most buttons are dead, Zegnat.
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Zegnat opens firefox to see what it is called
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Zegnat “private window” is what Firefox calls it. That’s what I use for all the WebRTC stuff. Can’t tell you where it is in your menu, as you are on Windows and I am not
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sketchess Display is half cut of, too. Hmmm.
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sketchess How is your experience with jitsi so far?
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sketchess tries private window mode
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Zegnat Jitsi’s camera view was weird once we got multiple people in there, and it seemed to really stress some CPUs (i.e. petermolnar’s)
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Zegnat So for our “photo” moment we switched to appear.in, and that made a difference both in quality and display
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sketchess Don't saw both in action yet.
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sketchess Woah. What a difference.... o.O
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sketchess checks the buttons
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Zegnat It does seem like the US guys are having a good time with Hangouts, so we might try that at some point. Maybe I am just inherently biased against Google.
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sketchess it still just let me mute audio and I still have half of the buttons below, but everything is on place now
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sketchess hah, I could create a room now, hahahaha.... that works too
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Loqi sketchess: lol
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sketchess -.- it throughs everything around again..... looks like I lost privat mode on the way then
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sketchess videyo was the best one so far for me
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Zegnat That’s client software though. The idea is not to require people to install software. Else sknebel and I would have been pushing mumble
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sketchess aha
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sketchess to google you will not get me back either tihihihihi
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Zegnat appear.in isn’t perfect either. It had the same issue as talky where not everyone in the call would be able to connect to eachother. (Especially Lukas and I.)
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Zegnat So if you know any better platforms for online video conferencing, do let us know and we can give it a try!
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sketchess I will be fine with appear + private mode. We will not get harmed by no camera access. ;)
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Zegnat I have my camera turned off almost always, to keep my internet costs down. So no problems there.
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sketchess And I am a shy person anyway, hahahah.
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sketchess Will the service be charged?
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Zegnat I am on a mobile data plan, so basically every MB is sacred
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sketchess ok, so that means appear is free to use
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Zegnat Yes, everything we discuss is free to use
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Zegnat Just your own internet costs apply, and mine are… high
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sketchess hmmm, looks like most services require to download something or at least making an account. interesting
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sketchess Had you to register for appear or jitsi, Zegnat?
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sketchess to keep the room
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sketchess ah, that's how it works (jitsi).... it's like a Demo^^
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Zegnat sketchess, I had no reason to register the room on my name, so no, I have not registered anywhere
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sketchess I see why you prefer appear.in, Zegnat. Ok.
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sketchess yeah not requested
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sketchess Didn't saw any other like the both so far.
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petermolnar what is mumble?
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Loqi Mumble is an open-source voice chat platform https://indieweb.org/Mumble
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petermolnar :sigh: mumble download button is js...
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petermolnar Zegnat if mumble is simple voip, why not linphone?
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petermolnar although I'm uncertain if linphone knows confcals
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petermolnar calls
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petermolnar ok, it's not a simple voip client for certain
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petermolnar forget it
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petermolnar (linphone)
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petermolnar so for me, mumble would be fine
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sketchess I would not mind to install something. *thought
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petermolnar a long while ago I thought I'll be a webrtc advocate, but it's been weird and - probably due to codecs and hd/fhd webcam resolutions - way too cpu insensive
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petermolnar I'm slowly realizing I'd rather go back to qvga res and the old skype, just please someone get it working easily, reliably and without burning down or drainig the battery in 1 hour of a laptop
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Zegnat I imagine clients should be able to let the user pick at what bitrate they want to push their webcam right? They just don’t allow for it most of the time, defaulting to “best possible”, which is both heavy on encoding (CPU) and bandwidth
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petermolnar they should, just noone bothers doing it, since everybody wants the best resolution!
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petermolnar battery life, meh
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sketchess Did you use vidyo yet, petermolnar?
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petermolnar yes, I did
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petermolnar surprisingly pleasant experience
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sketchess you were faster ;)
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sketchess for me better than skype ten times
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Zegnat I too was surprised by Vidyo. Loads of bandwidth settings available too, which I appreciated a lot. But Vidyo isn’t really consumer software.
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sketchess why not?
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sketchess only thing that bothered me that it automactically wants to start when pc gets turned on
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Zegnat Vidyo is enterprise software, AFAIK. It probably cost Mozilla a non-insubstantial sum to get all their conference rooms outfitted. I don’t believe we can set-up a Vidyo conference for IndieWeb just at the snap of our fingers.
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sketchess how pity
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sketchess hmmmm what about good old chat software.... wasn't it later possible to do it with ones like msn or icq or so?
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Zegnat Sure, that’s what petermolnar means with wanting the old Skype back ;)
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sketchess I like the 'old skypes' way better than the new ones. grrrrr they changed it once again. It tries to force me into google or microsoft accouts now.... no thank you, I rather die.
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Zegnat IndieAdvertisement: https://daringfireball.net/2017/07/df_display_ads - I hope Gruber succeeds on that model
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sketchess has no own skype, let the account deleted 5 years ago ;)
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sketchess I do not even have to watch youtube videos into youtube anymore. xD No Silos for me.
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sketchess having a beark
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sketchess re
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sketchess Huh, appear does have a short cut to mute or unmute audio, but does not have any for video. How odd.^^
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Zegnat For muting and unmuting yourself? That might be their way of supporting push-to-talk
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sketchess Well now I have at least a letter, if the buttons disappear. *lol*
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petermolnar that article of [chrisaldrich] got me thinking that though posts are definitely a problem for filter bubble algorithms maybe events are just as much of a problem, yet event cross-posting is niche even within the indieweb community; I'm guessing mostly because of the lack of tools
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petermolnar none of the WordPress event plugins I know of have capabilities to do this, for example
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@scott_gruber @indiewebcamp are web mentions appropriate for numerous content types like articles, books, recipes and pages, or primarily for blogs? (twitter.com/_/status/886594872622301184)
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@petermolnar @scott_gruber @indiewebcamp #webmention is not restricted to content types, it's only a notification and… https://twitter.com/i/web/status/886598952044433408 (twitter.com/_/status/886598952044433408)
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@petermolnar @scott_gruber @indiewebcamp also see http://indieweb.org/post_type#Kinds_of_Posts for current solutions, including RSVPs, recepies, reads, checkins, etc. (twitter.com/_/status/886599175537913856)
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@scott_gruber @indiewebcamp Sending a Webmention is not limited to blog posts & can be used for additional kinds of content & res… https://twitter.com/i/web/status/886599368236650497 (twitter.com/_/status/886599368236650497)
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@scott_gruber @petermolnar @indiewebcamp Thanks Peter. I’m reading the spec and the write up here. https://indieweb.org/Webmention-developer (twitter.com/_/status/886599902544842753)
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@scott_gruber I'm reading about Implementing Webmentions in @grabaperch by @drewm cc @indiewebcamp. https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions (twitter.com/_/status/886602226046648320)
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Loqi [indienews] New post: "Implementing Webmentions" https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions (from https://aaronparecki.com/2017/07/16/4/)
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sketchess see ya around
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sl007 about webmentions https://allinthehead.com/retro/378/implementing-webmentions
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Loqi [Drew McLellan] Implementing Webmentions
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@sl007 @drewm webmention, websub and micropub belong to the building blocks of http://indieweb.org - join us https://indieweb.org/2017/Dortmund ? CAMPFIRE (twitter.com/_/status/886636584040378369)
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Loqi [superfeedr] "Virtual HWC Europe" by Jeremy Cherfas on 2017-07-12 https://stream.jeremycherfas.net/2017/virtual-hwc-europe
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Loqi [superfeedr] "Hi Chris, I unfortunately must correct my opinion about my solution of "having read posts" by means of google books iframes - these posts load" by Andreas Petersell on 2017-07-16 http://www.petersell.com/2017/hi-chris-i-unfortunately-must-correct-my-opinion-about-my
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Zegnat Thank you superfeedr, but that event has gone.
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TheGillies what's a good tool for sending webmentions?
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TheGillies only one tool under tools on webmention wiki page hrm.
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[miklb] that’s a little trickier with static sites as the post needs to exist before the mention can be sent
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Zegnat telegraph is good
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Zegnat What is telegraph?
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Loqi Telegraph is an open source API and service for sending webmentions, part of the p3k suite https://indieweb.org/Telegraph
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[miklb] when I ran Jekyll, used a Rake task to send the mention after the build/deploy
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Zegnat Telegraph lets you send Webmentions for any page. Though I am unsure if it has an API or if you must du it manually
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TheGillies I want to do it manually
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TheGillies all my content is hand crafted. I don't even use a static site generator like jekyll
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aaronpk there are some command line tools
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aaronpk the hardest part is finding the webmention endpoint, other than that it's just a POST request
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TheGillies telegraph looks like what I'm looking for
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aaronpk https://indieweb.org/Webmention-developer#Sending
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TheGillies I like telegraph because it's hosted. I'm avoiding code on purpose heh
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TheGillies https://academics.skidmore.edu/blogs/flip/?p=113
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petermolnar or just use cURL
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Zegnat I have used Telegraph too, when I wanted to send multiple webmentions at once. Else I use cURL.
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TheGillies anyone have a minimal snippet of webmention post that includes requisite fields to display properly? like username avatar etc?
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TheGillies Looking at linked posts non of that is in the h-entry itself yet still manages to propagate
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TheGillies none of that*
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aaronpk like to receive comments?
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TheGillies to send comments
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TheGillies I'm crafting a like to someone
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TheGillies but it's not showing up
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aaronpk oh, you can try testing with https://webmention.rocks to see at least whether you're sending it correctly
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Zegnat Just example HTML for a like? https://licit.li/592dbd6c53caa
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TheGillies aaronpk: which test #?
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TheGillies Zegnat: thnx
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aaronpk any of them will work for this purpose
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aaronpk they're actually more about testing whether your webmention client can find the webmention endpoint correctly, but if you're sending via telegraph it does that all for you
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TheGillies the problem is my markup
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TheGillies your site accepts it, but it looks like shite because it's just an empty avatar with no text anywhere lol
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@pgbovine I feel really old. I just learned that this was a thing https://indieweb.org -- I had just assumed everyone did this (twitter.com/_/status/886685658017800203)
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aaronpk hmm, i don't think we have a validator specifically for these types of posts
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aaronpk https://indiewebify.me/validate-h-entry/ is close but won't check for the "u-like-of" property
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TheGillies most of my mentions are going to be likes since I can't be bothered to write a proper post
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Zegnat Does XRay do likes, aaronpk? That might be the nicest testing tool for how your markup is parsed
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aaronpk yeah it'll parse likes. it won't tel you waht's wrong but at least it's a bit easier to test that way
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aaronpk tho it'll cache what's at the URL so you'll have to enter the HTML into the box if you're making changes quickly https://xray.p3k.io/
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Zegnat TheGillies: try your markup (or link to post) here http://xray.p3k.io/
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Zegnat Aah, alright, do what aaronpk says and don’t use link :p
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@m_ott @brad_frost @drewm @pfefferle Aaaand also an #IndieWeb plugin: https://de.wordpress.org/plugins/indieweb/ (twitter.com/_/status/886708869724086272)
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Loqi [superfeedr] "Hi Chris, I unfortunately must correct my opinion about my solution of "having read posts" by means of google books iframes - these posts load" by Andreas Petersell on 2017-07-16 http://petersell.com/2017/hi-chris-i-unfortunately-must-correct-my-opinion-about-my